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  1. #14
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Office and warehouse in both Crystal River & New Port Richey ,FL
    Posts
    18,836
    Yes,Home Depot and the mfrs of filters are doing a disservice to consumers ,by not warning about the possible effects on air flow.


    I'm advocating that consumers should get "better" filtration,from a contractor that can design or redesign the ducts ,as needed to insure proper air flow.


    TXv's installed "helter-skelter",like high PD filters ,do cause damage.LOL!

  2. #15
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    4H: Hot, Humid Houston H.O.
    Posts
    3,304

    How is that?

    >>TXv's installed "helter-skelter",like high PD filters ,do cause damage.

    Dash, could you offer a one or two-sentence explanation of how a TXV might cause damage? How much should a homeowner concern himself with this possibility? Until now I had heard only good things about this device, am interested in knowing the other side of the story.

    Best wishes -- P.Student

  3. #16
    I'm afraid another post by someone else has been taken on an excursion.
    ANYTHING installed "Helter-Skelter" can do damage.

    Irascible described TXV'S in comparison to piston as a way of showing better and good in an attempt to show that the cheaper filters are doing what the manufacturer intends.
    And he's right.

  4. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Concord, CA
    Posts
    2,635
    Originally posted by dash
    I'm advocating that consumers should get "better" filtration from a contractor that can design or redesign the ducts as needed to insure proper air flow.
    I have no argument with that.

    I'd love to see the study or data that convinced you a wet coil filters better than a fiberglass filter. It seems to be the basis for a lot of your recommendations. Yet in my mind it's clearly false. A fiberglass filter will get caked over and over while the coil gets barely a tinge of dirt. But you say it catches more? Pfft.

  5. #18
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    149
    I use the cheap pleated filters that Wal Mart sells for $1.88. I won't use fiberglass as I consider then to be worthless. I won't use the expensive pleated filters because they are a waste of money, and might reduce air flow.

    Yes, hardwood floors = more dirt because it can't absorb the dirt like a carpet can. I never saw dust tumbleweed until I moved someplace with hardwood floors.

  6. #19
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Concord, CA
    Posts
    2,635
    The last I checked a cheap pleated and 3M's pleated had similar pressure drops. The supposed difference in the 3M is that how it's made causes it to have an electrostatic charge. If you don't know your airflow situation and how the pleated is affecting it, then the pleated may be worth less and the fiberglass worth more than you think.

  7. #20
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Office and warehouse in both Crystal River & New Port Richey ,FL
    Posts
    18,836

    Re: How is that?

    Originally posted by perpetual_student
    >>TXv's installed "helter-skelter",like high PD filters ,do cause damage.

    Dash, could you offer a one or two-sentence explanation of how a TXV might cause damage? How much should a homeowner concern himself with this possibility? Until now I had heard only good things about this device, am interested in knowing the other side of the story.

    Best wishes -- P.Student
    Note the "LOL" after the my TXV example.

    I was just trying to make it clear that ,if the ducts are sized correctly,a "better" filter will do no damage ,just as a TXV ,properly installed will "do no damage".


    So the question is ,are "better" filters ,needed to protect the coil.My experience tells me they are.

    The "wet coils are equal to a merv 5 or 6" came from an ACCA session at the National Meeting,the speaker was Brendan Reid,if I remember correctly.

    I think he's with Comfort Institute,in Canada.


  8. #21
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Concord, CA
    Posts
    2,635
    Well OK. I'm sure that was enough to convince you. But my eyeballs and common sense tell me something different. You'll have to forgive me if I contradict you on the wet coil assertion each time I see it. I've been to some customer's houses for years on end and have replaced many filthy fiberglass filters the kept the coil plenty clean.

    The only way the statement could be true is if he was referring to the very smallest particulate sizes. They mostly pass right through the filter and coil but the water will catch some of it and rinse it down with the condensate. In and of itself it's hardly a compelling reason to make major changes.

  9. #22
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    956
    I thought the filters provided with the furnace was to protect the furnace. besides the blower not much else to worry about getting dirty.

    I have seen alot of bad coils here that use fibre filters.

    Coils aren't boxed like down south so rarely get checked, I'm the only one I know that does it regularly.

  10. #23
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Office and warehouse in both Crystal River & New Port Richey ,FL
    Posts
    18,836
    As mentioned ,newer coils have fins closer together,and some are "lanced",both contributing to more problems than older coils.

    We test the coil PD on most calls and all first starts and checkups,we find a lot of coils that "look" clean ,aren't.

  11. #24
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    172
    The main problem is as Big I mentions, AIRFLOW RESTRICTION lots of people out there start having evap freezeup problems after going to pleated high restriction type filters. Lots of systems are very marginal on airflow and the filter media changeover sends them over the cliff. It is good in a way for techs, it is a easy to fix service call, usually less than ten minutes a man can make a whole bunch of those a day maybe 30 or 40? at around 80 bucks per pop so that is around 2500 bucks per day and 7 days a week and 52 weeks per year man thats almost a million bucks per year now thats pretty good money huh. You folks get on over there and buy up those expensive pleated filters and get them in your systems as soon as possible that is a order! LOL

  12. #25
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    51
    More excellent information! Thanks!

    My HVAC maintenance company recommended AGAINST putting pleated filters in my system...they guy said the system could freeze up, which was news to me! YIPES! I was just trying to get some better filtration and air quality, but I don't want to restrict my air flow or compromise my system. I think I'll switch back to the cheapie filters for a while to see if my system runs better...and to see if I can detect any appreciable changes in the air quality.

    Thanks again to all you professionals who are so willing to share your knowledge and expertise!

  13. #26
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    2,927

    Re: How is that?

    Originally posted by perpetual_student
    >>TXv's installed "helter-skelter",like high PD filters ,do cause damage.

    Dash, could you offer a one or two-sentence explanation of how a TXV might cause damage? How much should a homeowner concern himself with this possibility? Until now I had heard only good things about this device, am interested in knowing the other side of the story.

    Best wishes -- P.Student
    I will attempt to answer this.
    Txv has potential to fail in the open position.(see "heat tape" thread for humor and enlightenment)A fixed piston will most always fail in the other way,it will get restricted,but rarely this happens.
    Also the txv has movable parts that wear out with time.
    Txv is adjustable,and this intrigues some people.They mess with it.

    For climates where AC is only needed a few months at most, I dont think Txv is worth the hassles.You in the south,and Dash in the "ac capitol" ,have differnt needs...


    And while I am here,I agree with Irascible 100%.Pleated filters are for babies and old women...

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