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Thread: mod con boilers

  1. #14
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Massachusetts
    Posts
    6,837
    Yeah, right. These factory reps are getting high on their own technology and they're screwing people without knowing it. They change the programming for the inducer blower to change the boiler input. That works well as long as the original control board is in the boiler. But when (not IF, but WHEN) the control board tanks and a guy puts a new one in, it's going back to the original rating, not the modified rating. That modification went away with the old board.

    In days gone by, I did some factory work on the old HeatMakers. They were also multi-rated for different sizes and all one had to do was change the gas orifice and combusiton air disk. But once those were changed, the tag was also changed on the boiler and unless someone changed the orifice or disk, no matter what else on the boiler was changed, it would always be the new size. That's not the case when reprogramming a digital board. So much for progress.
    If YOU want change, YOU have to first change.

    If you are waiting for the 'other guy' to change first, just remember, you're the 'other guy's' other guy. To continue to expect real change when you keep acting the same way as always, is folly. Won't happen. Real change will only happen when a majority of the people change the way they vote!

  2. #15
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    60
    i have come up with asolution all on my own make them accountable a 10 year part warranty out of the box or how about a 36,000 mile warranty increase the waranty increase the quality.now its a joke they will through anything together.JUst like cars a factory warranty

  3. #16
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Red Deer, Alberta
    Posts
    653
    Quote Originally Posted by skippedover View Post
    Yeah, right. These factory reps are getting high on their own technology and they're screwing people without knowing it. They change the programming for the inducer blower to change the boiler input. That works well as long as the original control board is in the boiler. But when (not IF, but WHEN) the control board tanks and a guy puts a new one in, it's going back to the original rating, not the modified rating. That modification went away with the old board.

    In days gone by, I did some factory work on the old HeatMakers. They were also multi-rated for different sizes and all one had to do was change the gas orifice and combusiton air disk. But once those were changed, the tag was also changed on the boiler and unless someone changed the orifice or disk, no matter what else on the boiler was changed, it would always be the new size. That's not the case when reprogramming a digital board. So much for progress.
    So what was wrong with that (the old way)? I have researched many modern boilers/furnaces and found that reliability is just what you have implied. Perhaps there is something amiss with the modern regulations, in that they don't take into account the long, long term costs of operation. Not to get into a fight here, but my mom's old boiler finally gave out after 86 years, so why can't our better modern technology do as well?

    Just a comment... Not a stand...

  4. #17
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Massachusetts
    Posts
    6,837
    Quote Originally Posted by enb54 View Post
    So what was wrong with that (the old way)? I have researched many modern boilers/furnaces and found that reliability is just what you have implied. Perhaps there is something amiss with the modern regulations, in that they don't take into account the long, long term costs of operation. Not to get into a fight here, but my mom's old boiler finally gave out after 86 years, so why can't our better modern technology do as well?

    Just a comment... Not a stand...
    The new boilers are all about efficiency. The old boilers were all about providing heat at any cost. So the old technology was a big, heavy, cast iron block with a lot of water within it. Todays boilers have very thin heat exchangers and very little water within. Since the flame must be large to heat the home, the water circulation through the boiler must be proper or the boiler will quickly melt. All of the controls needed to insure proper circulation (circulator motors do stop working sometimes) and/or flame control is a major issue.

    The problem addressed in this thread is that the boiler manufacturer blew the design. By that I mean that they've rated the boiler at 200,000 and thier design error is that it fires the boiler at maximum first, then backs it down to as low as 1/5 of maximum or 40,000 Btu's. So when a small zone calls, it's not the 40,000 Btu turndown that's the issue, it's the 200,000 Btu start-up with only 30,000 Btu's of circulation. If they had fired the boiler at 40,000 Btu's and then increased to 200,000, there would be no problem.

    So the tech reps solution is to cap the boiler maximum at 160,000 Btu's and hope the small zone can handle the reduced input on start up long enough to keep the boiler vessel from failing in 3 years again. Mind you, the boiler is and was properly sized for a 160,000 Btu design temperature load. That manufacturer now has a new model of the boiler out that does fire at a lower stepped rate and that can be set at 6 different level for 6 different loads, eliminating the problem. But they claim they can't retrofit that technology into the "older" models, so once again, the installing company gets screwed by the factories failure to properly know what goes on out in the field. Not all the world is a laboratory. Most manufacturers haven't figure that out as yet.
    If YOU want change, YOU have to first change.

    If you are waiting for the 'other guy' to change first, just remember, you're the 'other guy's' other guy. To continue to expect real change when you keep acting the same way as always, is folly. Won't happen. Real change will only happen when a majority of the people change the way they vote!

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