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  1. #27
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Urbandale IA. USA
    Posts
    4,934
    mr 134a, you sound like a government paid engineer type. That is a compliment.

    I seem to remember a few years ago, someone on THIS SITE tried exactly what you originally described. They converted a system to 134a and it worked.
    I did a search, and I cannot find it. Maybe the mods deleted it when one of their computers crashed.

    I don't like POE oil ! ! ! and I would welcome ANYTHING that will bring back the OLD mineral oil. Unfortunately r134a will NOT accomplish that.

    I have wondered what other refrigerant could be used that the INSIDERS/lawmakers will NOT declare dangerous, or OFFENSIVE to THEIR CAUSE...

    My 2 cents......

    .
    Those who dance, appear insane to those who do not hear the music.
    Those who believe, appear ignorant to those who do not know God.

  2. #28
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Yuma, AZ
    Posts
    2,361
    Quote Originally Posted by condenseddave View Post
    R12 was a very common refrigerant many years ago, for light commercial and residential cooling.

    Have you ever actually seen the size of a 5 ton air handler and condensing unit that uses 12???????
    This is close to the driving reason. R22 drove R12 and R500 out of the market because the first cost of the equipment gave R22 the advantage. This is simple economics that we contractors face all of the time with low ballers. Price matters a lot.

    Goodman was about to become the largest HVAC manufacturer about 10 years ago. Carrier bought up ICP to hold its position at the top.
    "I have never let my schooling interfere with my education."
    Mark Twain
    More at: http://www.quotationspage.com/subjects/education/

  3. #29
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    wedged in freezer shelf
    Posts
    6,749
    Quote Originally Posted by amd View Post
    ...and GWP has exactly what to do with ozone depletion?
    Ozone Depletion?
    Isn't that old thing that was going to kill us all.
    Did they come up with the new thing.
    GW is getting a little old now too
    “If You Can Dodge A Wrench You Can Dodge A Ball”

  4. #30
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    where the beer flows like wine
    Posts
    2,871
    wait and see 410a jump to the "dark side" as soon as the patents expires then a new savior will arrive and once again rescue mother earth from evil, we all most bow and thank with gratitude the US government,DuPont,Arkema and Honeywell among many others, without them we wouldn't be here today. thank you,thank and thank you!!!

  5. #31
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Yuma, AZ
    Posts
    2,361
    Quote Originally Posted by hvacpope View Post
    wait and see 410a jump to the "dark side" as soon as the patents expires then a new savior will arrive and once again rescue mother earth from evil, we all most bow and thank with gratitude the US government,DuPont,Arkema and Honeywell among many others, without them we wouldn't be here today. thank you,thank and thank you!!!
    There are true believers. They follow the leaders. Want to know what the leaders are doing and why....Follow the money. Can you say, "Al Gore"?
    "I have never let my schooling interfere with my education."
    Mark Twain
    More at: http://www.quotationspage.com/subjects/education/

  6. #32
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN, USA
    Posts
    34,189
    Have a Carrier
    Attached Images Attached Images

  7. #33
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    wedged in freezer shelf
    Posts
    6,749
    Quote Originally Posted by hvacpope View Post
    wait and see 410a jump to the "dark side"
    It already has
    Same with 134
    “If You Can Dodge A Wrench You Can Dodge A Ball”

  8. #34
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    houston, texas
    Posts
    3,787
    Quote Originally Posted by hvacpope View Post
    wait and see 410a jump to the "dark side" as soon as the patents expires then a new savior will arrive and once again rescue mother earth from evil, we all most bow and thank with gratitude the US government,DuPont,Arkema and Honeywell among many others, without them we wouldn't be here today. thank you,thank and thank you!!!
    The savior is to be R441a with 0 gwp. Wonder how much more that will cost us?
    I'm not tolerating Political Correctness anymore, from now on it's tell it like it is.

    Veto Pro Pak - The best tool bag you'll ever own






  9. #35
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    where the beer flows like wine
    Posts
    2,871
    Most of the world didn't sign the Montreal Protocrap,R-11, R-12, 500 etc are widely used in the rest of the world,counties like China or India dont have laws about controlling the sales or venting refrigerants. In the US all the nonsense becomes gospel and the government regulates and regulates making it very difficult for our economy to compete with the rest of the world giving big business the excuse to move their operations to third world countries where anything goes, like Carlin used to say "its all BS and is bad for you"

  10. #36
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Barrie, Ontario
    Posts
    4,622
    Quote Originally Posted by hvacpope View Post
    Most of the world didn't sign the Montreal Protocrap,R-11, R-12, 500 etc are widely used in the rest of the world,counties like China or India dont have laws about controlling the sales or venting refrigerants. In the US all the nonsense becomes gospel and the government regulates and regulates making it very difficult for our economy to compete with the rest of the world giving big business the excuse to move their operations to third world countries where anything goes, like Carlin used to say "its all BS and is bad for you"
    True, true, and like someone else added, once the patents ran out on 11,12, 500, etc. some (large!) manufacturers lost a crap load of licensing cash and needed to dig up some new proprietary gases...

    That's what lobbyists are for, isn't it ? Win/Win... for the government and manufacturer... at the expense of the little guy. Should be called Win/Win/Lose
    Is this a Fabreze moment? C.Y.D. I'm voting white elephant. 2˘.
    My competition are my best salespeople!

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