Nice Rack. The Supermarket Refrigeration Thread

[ReferTek]

As a guy who makes his living keeping supermarkets cold, I wanted to start a new thread for the other market techs out there to talk about our systems, clients, hopes and dreams.......

[Armament]

Hussman seems to have an icredible relationship with Superstore in Atlantic Canada. An average of five of them pass through any given store in a day and tinker around. I`m used to going to small stores and having them ask what the problem is five minutes through the call.

[MikeySq]

Hussman seems to have an icredible relationship with Superstore in Atlantic Canada. An average of five of them pass through any given store in a day and tinker around. I`m used to going to small stores and having them ask what the problem is five minutes through the call.

5 of who are around tinkering?
HP is in pretty well with that chain out this way i'm pretty sure.

[jpsmith1cm]

Hmmm...

I think I started a 'Dream System" thread a few years ago.

Didn't get the results I'd hoped for.


The future of supermarket refrigeration is going to be exciting.

With CO2 secondary systems, CO2 cascade systems, the possibility of restrictions on HFC refrigerants due to their global warming impact, energy prices rising and other economic concerns, we are simply NOT going to be able to operate under the old "business as usual" model.

WE, the techs, are going to have to change with these systems, adapt to them, learn them or we are going to be replaced by smarter, younger and, ultimately, cheaper guys.

For one, I'm looking forward to new controllers, new (old?) system like CO2 and NH3 making a return.

[Pascone10]

Hmmm...

I think I started a 'Dream System" thread a few years ago.

Didn't get the results I'd hoped for.


The future of supermarket refrigeration is going to be exciting.

With CO2 secondary systems, CO2 cascade systems, the possibility of restrictions on HFC refrigerants due to their global warming impact, energy prices rising and other economic concerns, we are simply NOT going to be able to operate under the old "business as usual" model.

WE, the techs, are going to have to change with these systems, adapt to them, learn them or we are going to be replaced by smarter, younger and, ultimately, cheaper guys.

For one, I'm looking forward to new controllers, new (old?) system like CO2 and NH3 making a return.

Cheaper guys? Why do you think that??

[jpsmith1cm]

Cheaper guys? Why do you think that??

Everyone is trying to boost their bottom line in this economy.

I think that, in my market anyway, customers are going to try to go the "cheaper" route.

It may or may not work for them.

Some of the newer systems are very trouble-free which is almost scary.

Also, I am paid at "X" level. Now, you aren't going to be able to get me to do the same work for less.

Hire a new guy, though, and you can pay him less as he doesn't know what to expect.



This is just what I see possibly coming in the future.

[ReferTek]

Everyone is trying to boost their bottom line in this economy.

I think that, in my market anyway, customers are going to try to go the "cheaper" route.

It may or may not work for them.

I recently had a client (a large warehouse club) decide to go "the cheaper" route labor wise. Sure the contractor that got the account costs less per hour but they have to send 2 guys out instead of just one like me. Does 2 guys with 1/2 the knowelege equal one? They have also had major outages. I smile everytime I drive by and see 2 or three vans behind the store...

The moral of my story... cheaper is not always better.. but hey we all know that here.

Now a question for you other techs:
How many markets do you service?

I have 8 accounts with rack systems ranging from early 80's hussman racks to HP's latest.
Not to mention all the smaller stores.
I guess im just curious if every other refer guy is as busy as me

[R-JAD]

I agree with JP these national chain stores already have us by the balls with full service contracts and even setting our t&m rates, but if you want to stay working on the latest and greatest in controls and racks you need to be doing work for the majior chains. As the price keeps getting cut down the contractors proffit goes down which means cheaper labor. I call them first responders cheaper guys that can show up and man the call until he can either get walked through the call or put a bandaid on the problem until the top notch top paid mechanic can get there. This leads to cheaper guys replacing the true heavy hitters out there. Sorry for venting, I really do love markets I promise

[ReferTek]

Sorry for venting, I really do love markets I promise

No worries. I figured this thread would be used for a lot of venting. Its a dynamic indusrty we are in and im sure we have all had what I call "Jim Bobs A/c sercive" come in and think they can play with a rack because they "know a/c"....
Hey everyone cant be "heavy hitters"..lol... just a few of us

[Riverguy553]

I work for Hill Phoenix in southern CA and I'm always busy. My main stores are Costco, Ralphs, Trader Joes and some independent markets. I see everything from old Scott polar racks to envirogaurd racks to Kimmel motz racks. But I do love my job!

[mojotyque]

I can see by your posts everyone here has a great deal of expericence wit these systems and must admit am a little intimidated to ask as a noobie, but where can I find good solid info on supermarket rack systems and controls- I've worked on small systems, self contained, split, W/I reach-in, restaurant, convenience store, etc., but want to grow into a more substancial part of this industry, any suggestions or advice, a push in the right direction would be greatly appreciated..........

[jimp]

Don't want anything to do with a grocery store, to many hours. I will keep my six hours a day job thank you.

[marter]

id love to get into that field but im stuck doing restaurants cold side/hot side and hvac

[valdelocc]

Hmmm...



WE, the techs, are going to have to change with these systems, adapt to them, learn them or we are going to be replaced by smarter, younger and, ultimately, cheaper guys.

where are the cheaper,smarter younger etc guys coming from? China? cause most of the young guys here want nothing to do with our trade and the few that venture in want to start at the top making the big bucks.

[MikeySq]

any suggestions or advice, a push in the right direction would be greatly appreciated..........

Read Read Read, start with the OEM websites
read about:
Compressor systems, case information, piping setup, controls setup

just a few sites:

HillPhoenix

Hussmann

Kysor-Warren

Zero-Zone

CPC Emerson

Micro Thermo

Danfoss Controls

Sporlan

Tyler Refrigeration

Cheers
Mike

[crackertech]

I can see by your posts everyone here has a great deal of expericence wit these systems and must admit am a little intimidated to ask as a noobie, but where can I find good solid info on supermarket rack systems and controls- I've worked on small systems, self contained, split, W/I reach-in, restaurant, convenience store, etc., but want to grow into a more substancial part of this industry, any suggestions or advice, a push in the right direction would be greatly appreciated..........

Lot's of good info here. http://hvac-talk.com/vbb/forumdisplay.php?f=56

[engineerdave]

JPs right.
With the EPA taking on almost gestapo-like power, the technology will be changing. Also, the newer controllers are getting VERY slick. It won't be too much longer before the store mgr will have an iPhone App that alerts him to "Failed Defrost, No Amp Draw, System 1C Ice Cream, Case 3". Think I'm kidding? This is what will make JPs concern about cheaper technicians a reality. So the question now is how do we stay relevant? These changes are coming, and coming quickly.

[emcontrols]

We need to pray for the over engineering engineers to do their job, and this will keep us all on our toes(job security). Staying up with the latest technologies and becoming heavily involved with the field R&D we might be able to help drive the way our future turns out.
The info I have been getting on the latest CO2 systems is disturbing at best, so called racks that are contained in a 6x6x6 box doesnt leave a lot of room for break downs or repairs. Sounds like maybe controls are going to be where the expertise is needed. Oh yea and pex pipe to cases with a stat and solenoid. (plumbers). Anybody else hear of these?????????

[crackertech]

We need to pray for the over engineering engineers to do their job, and this will keep us all on our toes(job security). Staying up with the latest technologies and becoming heavily involved with the field R&D we might be able to help drive the way our future turns out.
The info I have been getting on the latest CO2 systems is disturbing at best, so called racks that are contained in a 6x6x6 box doesnt leave a lot of room for break downs or repairs. Sounds like maybe controls are going to be where the expertise is needed. Oh yea and pex pipe to cases with a stat and solenoid. (plumbers). Anybody else hear of these?????????

Last co2 rack room that I seen (it was a pic) that a friends co had built it had lot's of room. Pex to cases.

[-frozen-ocean-]

Is the C02 in the pex? Ya pretty soon well see blinking lights for error codes and any guy can find the problem. Finding good help now a days is hard.