Guaranteed Performance
Page 1 of 5 12345 LastLast
Results 1 to 13 of 56
  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    7
    I am a homeowner looking to buy a new furnace and air conditioner. I have read many stories on this site from homeowners that stated they did not see any savings. In some cases their bills actually increased. On the other hand I have read information on this site and others that the actual performance of a furnace and air conditioner can be measured and documented.I was wondering if any contractor here or anywhere guarantees that the eqipment that they install will perform and deliver the heating and cooling btu's and efficiency within 10% of the equipment rating plate? If not can I hold back payment until this is accomplished?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Toledo, Ohio, United States
    Posts
    12,899
    Get over all this stuff and find someone that you can trust and simply buy from them, There must be someone in your area that has a good reputation. Inregards to savings, generally you will save money simply by replacing old inefficient equipment with modern high eff. equipment.

    sometimes I think people want to over think this, ask your friends and neighboors who they use.

    No Heat No Cool You need Action Fast

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Office and warehouse in both Crystal River & New Port Richey ,FL
    Posts
    18,836
    Originally posted by reddog4
    I am a homeowner looking to buy a new furnace and air conditioner. I have read many stories on this site from homeowners that stated they did not see any savings. In some cases their bills actually increased. On the other hand I have read information on this site and others that the actual performance of a furnace and air conditioner can be measured and documented.I was wondering if any contractor here or anywhere guarantees that the eqipment that they install will perform and deliver the heating and cooling btu's and efficiency within 10% of the equipment rating plate? If not can I hold back payment until this is accomplished?
    You are wise to ask,there are so many things that can effect the SEER and actual saving,all in the control of the contractor ,not you,unless you change the operating temperatures.

    If your in Florida,Carrier Factory Authorized dealers ,have a program that guarantes 25% saving for replacing < then 10SEER with a 12,or replacing a 12 with 14SEER >.

    It's all in writing and paid from the distributer.Only pays for the first year,but of the few claims we have had ,we always find there was something that wasn't right,and correct it.Only once in 5 years ,has it been,the customer running it a lot colle and warmer.


    Now I doubt you find this program outside of Florida,but it's worth mentioning when you buy,and closely monitoring your monthly bills and calling if the savings aren't there,don't wait until the end of a year.

    One of the most common things to negate savings is a high Static (too much resistance) duct system.We learned this when we started guaranting savings and check them more closely before the sale today.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    7
    That's the reason I have come to this site in the first place. I have checked with freinds and neighbors already and most are disappointed with the hvac contractors in the area and disappointed with the performance of the equipment. How can I trust a contractor who won't guarantee his work? According to your reply I shuold be satisfied with whatever I get stuck with.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Office and warehouse in both Crystal River & New Port Richey ,FL
    Posts
    18,836
    What city and state are you located in?Someone here may in your area or likely knows a great contractor there.

    Please understand that most won't guarantee saving ,due to variables and the fear what it could cost.That by no means ,indicates the quality of there work or dedication to their customers.

    Performance based pricing,is popular in commercial work,so it may make it to residential in a few years.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    9
    Originally posted by reddog4
    That's the reason I have come to this site in the first place. I have checked with freinds and neighbors already and most are disappointed with the hvac contractors in the area and disappointed with the performance of the equipment. How can I trust a contractor who won't guarantee his work? According to your reply I shuold be satisfied with whatever I get stuck with.
    I'm not a professional, just another homeowner who attempts to educate myself in order to make informed decisions on the products and services I buy. I beg to differ with you in that I don't agree that you can hold the contractor solely responsible for the performance of the system. You can certainly help yourself by searching for a contractor who has a strong reputation, but the end result also depends on whether the equipment itself performs. Even if installed properly, sometimes good equipment will fail or underperform. Is it fair to the contractor to have to eat the loss if they made a good faith effort to properly install it? If something goes wrong, my expectation of a quality contractor is that they will continue to try and improve this situation to the degree they can impact it.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    7,680
    Sorry but the contractor is soley responsible for the performance of the machine. He is the retailer you are the customer. No one else makes any agreement to get into such an arrangement. The mfg. warranty parts if they fail, and the performance data they show has been verified by an outside agency. There are too many variables in the installation that can infuluance that data.

    Unless of course you want to pay them install a meter dedicated to just your hvac system, along with temperature and humidity recoderd for a year so on the old then on the new so the data can be analized from weather to your habbits and measured against new equipment.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    4,970
    On a deal like that guaranteeing what they will save or not paying....... homeowner might decide to keep his doors open. If they do save you more then they say....does the home owner have to come back and pay more? Im not trying to get smart but like they say there are too many variables and what else is sold out there that guarantees it will do everything they claim. Ever try to take a 30,000 dollar car back being it doesnt get the mileage they claim it will get? Im sure lawyers would love it, all the sueing but their the only ones that would make anything so you best try to pick the best shop you can and hope for the best. If you want the kind of guarentee it sounds like, good luck being I would never try to guarentee something that there are so many things homeowners can do to make it not show as big of savings as was advertized.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Location
    WYO
    Posts
    2,019
    I disagree with Doc here.The manufacturer is responsible for the machine,the contractor for the installation. the furnace and AC needs not only to be sized correctly, but is the existing ductwork compatiple?
    Manual D @J can answer these problems. You can compare these calculations with what you have, and add ductwork,insulation,windows, etc. as needed.
    If the furnace is installed correctly,and tested after for running characteristics,( Temp.rise, static pressure,Combustion analysis ,superheat ,etc) It should be giving the preformance the manufacturer stated.
    Look for a contractor to give you these results, but keep in mind, there are many variables to calculate, (usage, degree days, cost increases)
    You as a homeowner thru in the worst variable to a contractor. I WONT PAY.
    Working with a good contractor will solve both of your goals.Be upfront with what you want and expect. Pay extra for extra work. Youll both be happy.
    never say never

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Tampa, Florida
    Posts
    706

    Post i agree with doc

    i agree with doc. they spend mega-big money to guarantee that their equipment will live up to the standards they has set forthwith on their data spec sheets. contractor needs to fully examine the existing system, especially ductwork size and condition. if ducting is too small, it runs a higher static, causing system to lose performance. old ducts start leaking at the seams or connection, loss of performance. reddog, if want a contractor to guarantee the savings, you need to prepare yourself for potential upgrades to your system. you just can't throw in a high efficiency unit in place of an old, probably doesn't even have a s.e.e.r. rating and expect the killer savings. most of the variable speed units i've installed required some pretty sizable duct modifications. replacement of the supply plentum going back far enough in the truck line to handle the new air flow requirements. at the same time, resizing the return structure to meet the new requirements. if those few things are taken into consideration, he should be able to let you know what changes, if any, may be required. my x-boss rarely sold variable speed units because most folks just couldn't understand why all the extra stuff had to be done. like some people, they want the best unit, but don't want to cough up the coin to make it right. just put it in as they say, then later complain, and withhold monies cuz they expected it to do wonders. bottom line, you get what you pay for.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Toledo, Ohio, United States
    Posts
    12,899
    I can make a guarantee. I would guarantee that I would walk from a customer that starts that kind of BS.
    No Heat No Cool You need Action Fast

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Maine
    Posts
    483
    Originally posted by twilli3967
    I can make a guarantee. I would guarantee that I would walk from a customer that starts that kind of BS.
    Me too! Many homeowners go by dollar value of their energy bills only and do not take into consideration that energy prices have gone up a lot over the last year. Also weather is not the same from year to year and this needs to be taken into account.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Eugene, Oregon
    Posts
    1,209
    Yes be upfront with the contractor that you won't pay if you don't save 2$ on your energy bill. How long are you planning on holding the contractor hostage? How about this, you pay for trip fees because you left the t-stat in the off position,who cares if its 2 days old, breaker off? switch off? You pay! How many times do contractors suck it up to please HO's that buy new systems and want everything for nothing? Seek out an honest company doing honest work, you should expect to pay for that quality work. You should expect warranty coverage, 10 year is all we offer, that should make you feel confident you have a quality system that functions as designed.
    This is the kind of crap that just frosts my bucket! And to have other contractors agreeing, jeez

    And after all that, you get someone giving you all you want, free load calc, free duct design and hours of free labor only to have the HO go with the low baller who now has our designs.
    Sound familliar people.
    My ax has been ground. Thank you, thank you, I'll be here all week and please throw cash.
    Proud supporter of Springfield Millers and Oregon Ducks.

Page 1 of 5 12345 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Comfortech Show Promo Image

Related Forums

Plumbing Talks | Contractor Magazine
Forums | Electrical Construction & Maintenance (EC&M) Magazine
Comfortech365 Virtual Event