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Thread: Return Air

  1. #27
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
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    1,841
    In future I will not trust the HVAC pro just because he has a license.


    License does mean he knows how to do it,just ask the next time can I see some of your work & ask around about the company.I don't think what he done was a bad thing just not the best.I would say 90% of the homes around you are like yours because everyone takes the lowest bidder they lay the house out like that so they can get the job.If you do it again tell the contractor wait you won't.Everyone learns as you go in life.

  2. #28
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
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    1,841
    In new construction we always put returns in all rooms but the bathrooms and kitchens but it is easily done with the walls open.

    For some reason they just don't do it like that in the south.

  3. #29
    Originally posted by gillman-air
    Andrew, I am a contractor here in middle GA. If you would like I could come by next week and see if we could find an inexpensive solution to your problem.
    I will be out of town on business for the next two weeks but after that would be good..

    I am in Warner Robins is this in your area ?

    AB

  4. #30
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    136
    Originally posted by andrew boyce
    They did not offer me that as an option.. I did not know enough to ask. but problems with my professional install has resulted in me looking for information to help me find out more about the subject.

    This board has offerd much help and frustration..

    I would have spent what ever it took to do it right But I was led to beleve that I was getting the best solution that could be got.

    Now the house is built and there is no way to go back and add or change things as it is a two story house and it is on a Slab..

    I dont want to have them start cutting into walls and SR to add stuff.

    And it would cost much much more to do now than when it waas under construction.

    In future I will not trust the HVAC pro just because he has a license. I will educate myself and become a DIY-er as I am now convinced that this is the only way to get it done correctly.

    IT is not about the money if the solution works. And now after spending time looking at people post on this board I see the same lack of customer care as the local contractors have in my area.

    I guess it is an HVAC thing but it is also my money and I will look for someone that is truly intrested in solving my needs. for this I will pay wat ever it costs..

    AB


    AB,
    We do understand your frustration and can only offer some advice to a point, since we can’t see the actual layout it’s impossible to advise you on how to make corrections.

    Gillman has offered to look at the job, once there he can confirm your current duct systems.

    This site is a great tool to help educate the home owner so he or she can have a better understanding of their HVAC system but it will not provide step by step instructions on how it fix your problem.

    Several people hear have responded to your post in a positive informative way. I’m not sure why the above statements were made other then your letting the problem get the best of you

    It can be fixed

  5. #31
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Office and warehouse in both Crystal River & New Port Richey ,FL
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    18,836
    Originally posted by trane
    Dash, I will agree that the 3M filters are the cause of a lot of problems but the fact that they load up to fast is not the real problem with them. Loading up fast means they are doing a better job than a cheap filter and the only way to get around this is more filter area. In the perfect world all homes would be better if they used the 3M filters and had enough filter area to use them. P Student even says this in his post and did't defend his statement about increasing filter area and then being able to use any filter you want.
    Quote
    Many older houses have duct design which is kind of neglectful, with resulting excessive vacuum in the return (and excessive External Static Pressure the equipment must work against). If that is your situation, and you can afford to spend a few hundred, you can correct both problems at once by adding return capacity and having it located in the bedrooms. Once you have done that, assuming you have generous return capacity and filter area, you will be free to use almost any filter you want without harming the equipment or airflow.

    100% correct, as long as you have enough filter area you can use these filters.

    3M loads up too fast due the type material being used,this doesn't make it a better filter.A 1" pleated media type filter with the same merv rating won't load up as fast,and if they are the same merv,than they are equal ,in filtering ability.


    Yes,more are of filter ,will allow more time between changes,but why would you want to go to that expense,it's eaasier and smarter to ,just not use a 3M filter,

  6. #32
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    midwest
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    2,868
    Dash, I don't want to be hard to get along with but what is it loading up with to fast? There are not filters that catch the bad and let the good particles by. Loading up fast means it is doing a better job at catching smaller particles and saying that a filter that does not load up as fast is just as good is not right.
    Quote from Dash
    3M loads up too fast due the type material being used,this doesn't make it a better filter.A 1" pleated media type filter with the same merv rating won't load up as fast,and if they are the same merv,than they are equal ,in filtering ability.

    I disagree, loading up faster does make it a better filter. If I am wrong then please explain.

  7. #33
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    middle georgia
    Posts
    239
    Andrew, Just look for me in the yellow pages. I'm in the houston county book not the WR. Gillman heating and air.
    Please step AWAY from the condensing unit.

  8. #34
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Posts
    327
    Most of the homes that have returns in each room have ductwork that was designed for heat only and really dont have the cfm capacity needed for good return volume.

    Remember, as far as return air goes, "if ya can't suck it in, ya can't sspit it out". If you really want to see how
    effective your return is, turn the blower on and then try to open the return opening at the unit. With inadequate returns, the door will be very difficult to open, and BE VERY CAREFUL, THE SUCTION MIGHT BE STRONG ENOUGH TO PULL THE DOOR SHUT AND TAKE A COUPLE OF FINGERS WITH IT. With the door open, check the air velocity at the supply registers. It might just knock your socks off.

    It's amazing how increasing the return air can solve many airflow problems.

  9. #35
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    Aug 2002
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    Office and warehouse in both Crystal River & New Port Richey ,FL
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    Originally posted by trane
    Dash, I don't want to be hard to get along with but what is it loading up with to fast? There are not filters that catch the bad and let the good particles by. Loading up fast means it is doing a better job at catching smaller particles and saying that a filter that does not load up as fast is just as good is not right.
    Quote from Dash
    3M loads up too fast due the type material being used,this doesn't make it a better filter.A 1" pleated media type filter with the same merv rating won't load up as fast,and if they are the same merv,than they are equal ,in filtering ability.

    I disagree, loading up faster does make it a better filter. If I am wrong then please explain.
    Good media filters "load" larger particles on the surface ,then smaller particles deeper in the media.They won't become restricted as quickly as 3M.

    3M is like a piece of paper,everything "loads" on the surface,large and small.

    So with equal square inches of filter,the 3M will need to be changed much sooner.

  10. #36
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    4H: Hot, Humid Houston H.O.
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    3,304

    Why 3M's are different...

    What you are telling us seems to be that *other* brands of filters might provide equal or better filtering capacity while lasting longer. Is that right?

    We have discussed the 3M brand quite a lot, do you happen to know any particulars about Arm & Hammer (AH) or other brands? Just curious whether to consider 3M in a category all by themselves. I had tried the AH from a big-box store, it was pure chance I didn't buy 3M. After all that has been said from other peoples' experience, there seems no reason to use 3M as long as there are other brands available.

    FWIW I am running the AH until they are used up, keeping an eye on ESP as a measure of their loading up. Think I am doing manually, what Carrier Infinity does automatically with estimating filter life -- believe I am on the right track but there's always more to learn. Am thinking about a looser, cheaper type pleated paper filter when I buy more. Maybe a MERV 6 level if I find one to buy. Any comments on pleated paper vs. the spun polyester types?

    Thanks for sharing your experience -- P.Student

  11. #37
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    Aug 2002
    Location
    Office and warehouse in both Crystal River & New Port Richey ,FL
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    Yes,3M is equal to but loads up faster,assuming the same merv rating.

    We only tested the 3M,can't comment on the A&H.

  12. #38
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    Aug 2003
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    classicrock4you
    Professional Member

    Registered: Mar 2002
    Posts: 230
    Most of the homes that have returns in each room have ductwork that was designed for heat only and really dont have the cfm capacity needed for good return volume.



    WWWWWWWWHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAATTTTTTTT!

  13. #39
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    4H: Hot, Humid Houston H.O.
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    3,304

    Location, location, location

    >> Most of the homes that have returns in each room have ductwork that was designed
    >>for heat only and really dont have the cfm capacity needed for good return volume.

    I would be interested in knowing the region of the guy who posted that. As far as I know it could well be true *somewhere*. Naturally one would expect otherwise in those warmer climates where A/C is really not optional.

    So... where are you posting from?

    Best wishes -- P.Student

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