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Thread: Joel Osteen

  1. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dowadudda View Post
    I grew up Catholic. Alter Boy, catholic grade school, the whole shebang. When I left home, at 18, that was the end of that. I never cared for it. Thought it was nonsense. Still think most of the catholic stuff is cult like. MY OPINION>
    Similar roots....Grandpa's brother was a priest, my Grandma was his office manager, my Aunt was the office manager at our parish, and my cousin Tom is currently pastor of two parishes in Phenix City, AL.

    But, while I have dipped my toe in other waters, the RCC will always be "home" to me.
    Technical incompetence is NOT a sales tool....

  2. #41
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    I am not a fan of the "feel good" folks, for the same reason that I could never be a Protestant.

    I shake my head constantly, when I hear people arrogantly proclaming that they have "been saved" and/or "have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ"....as if obtaining salvation is as simple as saying "I do".....

    Who do they think they are? I am not about to declare God's judgement on myself in front of others.

    I too, read the Bible. I too, know what it says about salvation. But, I also recognize that no matter how much I believe, I come up short in my life.

    I don't KNOW that I am going to Heaven. I HOPE and I PRAY that when my judgement comes, that in his infinite mercy, he finds me worthy of an invite.

    I cringe when I read obituaries stating that "Mary Jones went to be with her Lord and Savior on December 22nd....." I can't think of anything more arrogant and presumptive.

    This IS "GOD" we are talking about, right? He can do anything he wants, regardless of what any of us think.....
    Technical incompetence is NOT a sales tool....

  3. #42
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    I have to agree John when it comes to their Religion the RCC plays hardball and the American Protestants play slo pitch softball.


    Expect nothing, yet expect the unexpected.
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  4. #43
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    OK, we have not had a good 'Biblical/Christian' arguement.. I mean discussion (brawl) in a while, I guess I should get into this one also...

    I grew up (grade school) Southern Baptist... then went to a Bible-thumping independent 'gospel' church with a retired military guy as pastor... talk about legalistic... OUCH!

    It took a lot of 'trials and tribulations' to get me to see that "...God is Love..." and that we live in a Grace age, not a Law age... Note that I am NOT saying one can do as they please, sin does have its consequences. However Christ paid the price on the Cross for those sins... so we could have a real, live, two way relationship with God/Father. Only thing we need to do is truly (with an open and committed heart) seek that relationship... and God will reveal Himself to us.

    And I can say in all honesty that relationship is truly the source of my life now.

    Concerning Joel Osteen: I have a background of Bible teaching and following Scripture, so JO's style is not comfortable to me. Also, there is something folks in Houston know: NOBODY except Joel and Victoria know how much or where the $$$ in the church is... this IMO will lead to a scandel and some legal issues sometime.

    I remember when I was flying back and forth to Houston when my Dad was in the hospital (about a dozen trips over 8-9 mos)... I asked a few of the shuttle van drivers what they thought of JO; every one said the same thing: He is not a preacher, he is a life coach... seems to fit to me...

    Back to Scripture: God tells us that He loves us, and that He wants us to grow to be all He created us to be (this is "God's will" IMO, after salvation through faith in Jesus Christ as one's saviour). God also tells us He will use 'trials and tribulations' to bring us closer to Him... IMO this is a basic truth of the Christian life. SOOO: If I see/hear a preacher-guy(girl) who does not teach this basic truth, the warning flags go up...

    OK, I have said enough for someone that has never heard JO speak live (listened to him on the radio a few times). I can say this: I enjoyed the building he uses now back in the 1980's when the Houston Rockets won the NBA Championship... It was called the 'Summit' back then.
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  5. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Markl View Post
    I am not a fan of the "feel good" folks, for the same reason that I could never be a Protestant.

    I shake my head constantly, when I hear people arrogantly proclaming that they have "been saved" and/or "have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ"....as if obtaining salvation is as simple as saying "I do".....

    Who do they think they are? I am not about to declare God's judgement on myself in front of others.

    I too, read the Bible. I too, know what it says about salvation. But, I also recognize that no matter how much I believe, I come up short in my life.

    I don't KNOW that I am going to Heaven. I HOPE and I PRAY that when my judgement comes, that in his infinite mercy, he finds me worthy of an invite.

    I cringe when I read obituaries stating that "Mary Jones went to be with her Lord and Savior on December 22nd....." I can't think of anything more arrogant and presumptive.

    This IS "GOD" we are talking about, right? He can do anything he wants, regardless of what any of us think.....




    "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)


    I for one believe in this verse. Christianity is based on the verse. Saying you believe Christ is our savior isn't enough you must truly believe. Because I keep Jesus close to my heart I believe all of my sins are forgiven. Based on this I know I'm going to walk with him one day.


    Gods written word is perfect, I do not fear that "he will do what ever he wants" as you put it. I know that he will do what is written, what he said.


    Call me arrogant if you like but how am I to spread the message of God's love without proclaiming the fact that he sent his only son to die for me?
    Those who restrain desire do so because theirs is weak enough to be restrained. (William Blake)

  6. #45
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  7. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by trey r View Post
    Call me arrogant if you like but how am I to spread the message of God's love without proclaiming the fact that he sent his only son to die for me?
    Spreading God's love is not the same as declaring that you have a place to his right in Heaven.

    Let's put it this way.....if Christ walked in the room right now, would you boldly proclaim, "Hey everybody, I'm IN !!!", or would you be on bended knee with your hat in your hand?
    Technical incompetence is NOT a sales tool....

  8. #47
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    Those who restrain desire do so because theirs is weak enough to be restrained. (William Blake)

  9. #48
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    The same to your avatar, Trey.

    Yeah, I'm not wanting to argue any longer and possibly make any enemies over this religious issue, to do so would be unholy so I'm bowing out.

    Thanks.

  10. #49
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    Before I type this, I want to say I am NOT saying either is right or wrong... just making observations from what I have seen and studied:

    The RCC church seems to believe that our behavior is the yardstick of our salvation...

    While the Protestant Church seems to believe that we are saved by God's Grace (Eph 2:8-9). Personally, I am in the latter camp, as I know while I do not measure up... I am also forgiven (that does not mean I escape the worldly consequences for choices... only that God forgave me).

    I also know that I do indeed have a real, live, two way, fullfilling, daily relationship with God/Father. Yes I talk to Him, and yes He speaks to me (and NO, I am not hearing voices... LOL). And I can say without reservation that I have prayed for things and seen miracles happen that I (only me) prayed for... most of them are not like parting the sea... rather a changed heart in a person.

    I truly believe God reveals Himself to each person as He chooses... so I cannot say 'this way is right' or 'that way is wrong'... What I can say is that when I see folks consciously walking in a way that is contrary to what I believe God has taught me in Scripture... then I am wary of trusting them (especially when they are preaching from a church). But then: The RCC has a different Bible than mine... so who am I to say I am right and they are wrong??? (My brother is RCC, I have read his material.)

    I do know this: When God wants me to become active in someone's life... He prompts me (I know the voice of my Shepherd), and I obey. Usually the results are in line with what God has taught me... The rest of the time, it is better for me to be an observer until I am called to do something pro-active.

    Funny how we all believe we are 'right' yet we all worship the same God... I guess this is one of those things where God has a larger understanding than I do... Hopefully, God will explain it to me when I get to 'the outerh side'. (BTW: There is absolutely NO doubt in my mind that God has redeemed my soul/spirit, and I WILL be walking THROUGH the pearly gates when this body quits).
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  11. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roadhouse View Post
    The same to your avatar, Trey.

    Yeah, I'm not wanting to argue any longer and possibly make any enemies over this religious issue, to do so would be unholy so I'm bowing out.

    Thanks.


    Hey leave her out of this!
    Those who restrain desire do so because theirs is weak enough to be restrained. (William Blake)

  12. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Markl View Post
    Spreading God's love is not the same as declaring that you have a place to his right in Heaven.

    Let's put it this way.....if Christ walked in the room right now, would you boldly proclaim, "Hey everybody, I'm IN !!!", or would you be on bended knee with your hat in your hand?
    Honestly John, in those circumstances: The Glory of God (as manifest through Christ) would be so blinding that even the most successful men/women in the world would be on their face in fear...

    I believe in the circumstances you speak of: I would be quietly saying; Thank-You for redeeming my soul/spirit!... and yes, probably on my knees.

    I do believe I can KNOW I am redeemed... at the same time living from a humble heart. The two seem to be opposites... yet they can be the same if Christ is the goal (not me).
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    Quality work at a fair price with excellent customer service!

    Romans Ch's 5-6-7-8

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  13. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Markl View Post
    Spreading God's love is not the same as declaring that you have a place to his right in Heaven.

    Let's put it this way.....if Christ walked in the room right now, would you boldly proclaim, "Hey everybody, I'm IN !!!", or would you be on bended knee with your hat in your hand?
    God's Word states that every knee shall bow and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father.

    I don't understand why you think that claiming the promise of salvation and eternal life that was made by God is presumptuous. God does tell us in John 3:16 that Jesus came that the world might have eternal life. In John 3:18 He tells us that we are not condemned if we believe, but if we do not believe, then we are condemned already.

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