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  1. #79
    MadeinUSA,

    You are correct I do not read your posts. even with the amount of time that I spend on here I just can't bring myself to the point that I can justfy spending any of it reading your posts,

    I gave up on you in the 9mm thread, when you resorted to name calling.

    I'm sorry, ( You are only on probation though I may try reading one of your posts in the future but not for at least 30 days) you may reapply in thirty days.

    Thank You,

  2. #80
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX
    Posts
    11,087
    Originally posted by fat eddy
    C'mon Shophound

    You can't be serious,

    If you had two people come to your home for estimates, say bama then me

    And Bama said the following,

    I did a load calc on your home but I am going to put in a unit that is to large anyway,then split the indoor coil in half, combine that with a two speed compressor, then turn your new ac unit into a heatpump by adding a bunch of components to it in the field.I suspect it will all work fine cause Its the same thing I did at my house.

    And I said the folowing,

    Yes mam\sir I have done many homes of this type in this area and I do beleive that your unit was improperly sized during the previous installation. I will install the proper size system that your home needs.None of the work I do will field modify the units in any way and possibly void any warranty that you are due from the manufacturer.

    Honestly who's would you buy ?

    Well, with me your analogy would't be appropriate. I'd love to have a setup like Bama's in my own home...the idea of a residential system that actually MODULATES according to demand is appealing to me. What most of us have is a system sized and installed to meet worst case conditions and is oversized when conditions are less severe but comfort cooling/dehumidification is still needed.

    You think Bama's rig is out in left field? So do a lot of people who question David Debian's approach down in humid Houston, Texas (www.centralcityair.com). So Debian's either snowing all his customers or he's actually onto something. I believe it to be the latter, as not only does his growing customer base indicate so, the actual science behind his approach, to my current level of understanding, also substantiates it.

    Personally, I think the residential HVAC market would be far better served by systems that had some measure of built-in capacity control rather than the bang on/bang off size it for worst case scenario approach that's all too common. Variable speed systems and modulating compressors or other forms of capacity control should be more the norm than the exception in humid climates, IMO.

    • Electricity makes refrigeration happen.
    • Refrigeration makes the HVAC psychrometric process happen.
    • HVAC pyschrometrics is what makes indoor human comfort happen...IF the ducts AND the building envelope cooperate.


    A building is NOT beautiful unless it is also comfortable.

  3. #81
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Gone
    Posts
    5,340
    Originally posted by fat eddy
    MadeinUSA,

    You are correct I do not read your posts. even with the amount of time that I spend on here I just can't bring myself to the point that I can justfy spending any of it reading your posts,

    I gave up on you in the 9mm thread, when you resorted to name calling.

    I'm sorry, ( You are only on probation though I may try reading one of your posts in the future but not for at least 30 days) you may reapply in thirty days.

    Thank You,
    $100.00 says you did read my posts, but you do not understand latent and sensible heat, and how they work together. Therefore you are unable to accept correction when being confronted with well educated individuals in this industry.

    “Only a fool ignores great and correct advice when it is given to him freely” MadeinUSA

  4. #82
    ShopHound said

    "What most of us have is a system sized and installed to meet worst case conditions and is oversized when conditions are less severe but comfort cooling/dehumidification is still needed"

    Are you referring to the ones that you did a load calc on ?

  5. #83
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Gone
    Posts
    5,340
    Originally posted by fat eddy
    MadeinUSA,


    I gave up on you in the 9mm thread, when you resorted to name calling.

    When someone tries to take my rights away, I am a straight shooter and call a spade a spade, and an idiot an idiot. Sorry if the truth hurts.

  6. #84
    Wait a minute,

    I just caught that he lives in Norman Ok, I calculated Norman OH,

    Then it might be a 2.5 ton with a three ton coil.

    [Edited by fat eddy on 02-26-2005 at 01:08 PM]

  7. #85
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX
    Posts
    11,087
    Originally posted by fat eddy


    "What most of us have is a system sized and installed to meet worst case conditions and is oversized when conditions are less severe but comfort cooling/dehumidification is still needed"

    Are you referring to the ones that you did a load calc on ?
    Think about it, Eddy. If you ever actually have run a heat load calculation, what is it based on? It is based on what indoor conditions you wish to maintain when extreme outdoor conditions are present. If you want the ASHRAE standard of 75 degrees DB/50% RH to be maintained when outdoor conditions are 105 degrees, you must size the equipment so it will meet that demand. Anything below that and you're running oversized, aggravated by piston metering devices. TXV's at least give a measure of modulation that compensates for a drop in sensible/latent heat load.

    • Electricity makes refrigeration happen.
    • Refrigeration makes the HVAC psychrometric process happen.
    • HVAC pyschrometrics is what makes indoor human comfort happen...IF the ducts AND the building envelope cooperate.


    A building is NOT beautiful unless it is also comfortable.

  8. #86
    Wait a minute all throughout this thread I stated that I used 95OA as design load condition, I drew that from living in Ohio not far from Norman OH.,

    I did not know that he was in Norman OK,and using a 105OA.

    Apparently I misread his OK for OH.

    And for those extra ten degrees I think an upgrade to a 2.5 ton unit would suffice.

  9. #87
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Posts
    6,071
    OK, you are not only an idiot, but a liar as well. I have read every word in this thread twice, at NO POINT did you state you used 95º as a base line. Also, I told you before you threw the gauntlet down I lived in Oklahoma, and again before you did your so called "100% right" guesstimate. Now you want to claim you never knew I lived in Oklahoma?

    But you then accuse me of lying? I have actually debated these things with people who knew what they were talking about (like David Debien) and did not have them resort to lying. In fact, on this site, David Debien admitted and agreed that my concepts "might" work.

    Now, to your baseless remark that
    Originally posted by fat eddy
    450 cfm per ton is a dew point of 56
    Now, with over 200 known variables affecting dew point, how can anyone (rocket science or not) throw out a remark like that? Dew point is a relationship between RH and coil temp. Coil temp is a function of refrigerant mass flow, mass flow of air, latent and sensible heat content of air, surface area of coil fins, velocity of air, Reynold's number of air as it passes the fin, and many other less robust variables. But apparently you can reduce it to a poorly worded sentence that applies to everyone?

    So, if I post certified laboratory data showing a dew point of 75 at 450 cfm, will you eat my shorts? Or will you claim you didn't know we were talking about air?

    My work here is done. You are not only wrong, you know you are wrong (as evidenced by your resorting to lies). I have but one thing else to say. . .when I sold my house in Oklahoma, I offered to replace the "abortion" as you called it with the York system of the buyer's choice, but after seeing the data collected on my home by York and Bristol, he opted to keep it. I would have not install something like that for a regular customer; only because it needs more testing.
    Hindsight is NOT a plan!

  10. #88
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Eastern PA
    Posts
    68,864
    OK, at least eddy is trying to make up for his mistake.

    That does not account for his attitude toward our industry in general and people like Bama, Made in USA and myself who's goal is only to better the industry. Fat eddy's nasty personal commentary to those of us who he could not hold a candle to show that he still has a long way to go.

    The references to how much money he makes is reminiscent of a certain hateful rastafarian jerk that used to post here.

    I like threads like this because I can agree with posts by such nemesis's as dash and made in usa for a change. It would be nice if fat eddy calmed down a little and tried to discuss without attacking and contradicting those of us who have been discussing so many issues here for years.

    And by the eddy, I don't give "credentials". I was simply referring to my experiences in one position I held. Currently I am working as an HVAC technical advisor to a foreign government whose country was devastated by a hurricane. Does that sound more impressive? Or do you routinely turn down that type of job also?

    All in all, I must agree with Collins on this one.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  11. #89
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    East Stroudsburg, PA
    Posts
    13,215
    Originally posted by BamaCracker
    Uh, huh.

    Try this one:

    1550 square feet in Norman, OK. 18 inches of wood cellulose in the attic, 5.5 inches in the walls. Double pane glass, on a slab, 3 bedroom, 2 bath.

    Give it your best shot. Need more info? Just ask.
    That's definitely a "K" and not an "H"...

  12. #90
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    East Stroudsburg, PA
    Posts
    13,215

    Talking Rooster Cogburn said:

    "Fill your hand, you sunuva*****!!!!!!!



  13. #91
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Office and warehouse in both Crystal River & New Port Richey ,FL
    Posts
    18,836
    Originally posted by fat eddy
    Wait a minute,

    I just caught that he lives in Norman Ok, I calculated Norman OH,

    Then it might be a 2.5 ton with a three ton coil.

    [Edited by fat eddy on 02-26-2005 at 01:08 PM]
    "I calculated Norman OH"

    I thought no calculations were involved,just "Carnak the Magnificent" was reincarnated!LOL

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