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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    NH & Cebu
    Posts
    1,608
    OK, I'm frustrated as hell. I just bid on a 12'x 16' walk-in freezer and got blown out by more than $3k by another contractor. I quoted Bally and he quoted something comparable. He's selling the box, outdoor unit and evap for what the Bally box is costing me. I know because the customer has been a customer of mine for years. I'm already not making anything on this, and would have to put it in for nothing to get it. To you salesmen and self employed types: who's boxes are you selling and why? I thought I was getting decent pricing on Bally, but I may need to look elsewhere...or go out of business

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Location!, Location!
    Posts
    929
    I've got the same problem with low-ballers. They beat the cr*p out of my prices and do a sh*t job, that I get the service calls on:
    me: why don't you just call the clown that put it in?"
    cust: "we can't get them to return our calls, they came here from Iowa(3 hrs)".
    disclaimer: Not all came from Iowa

    But I would wonder if the quality of the unit is comparable.

    I know how they cut corners on the panels, all the joints look like cr*p, most of the skin is not glued to anything. cheapest condensing unit at minimum size and undersized lines, fast cheep install, doors that fall down on too-small hinges. Walls that move, no screed. The customer has paid more than our price to own it after repairs.

    what I don't know is why, when spending 8-10 K$, you would shop price only.

    I have used bally, norlake, and a co. called US cooler in IL. US even made a door and frame for an old Kaiser box that I was very pleased with.

    I'm going to get a price from these guys for a small box:
    http://walkinrefrigeration.com/index.htm

    just to see...

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Guayaquil EC
    Posts
    10,081
    Three grand is a pretty big spread for a box that size. Bally is one of the highest quality walk-in makers out there and with that, they're definitely not the least expensive. There are many manufacturers who make what might be considered acceptable or comparable boxes at much lower prices to a refrigeration contractor. But you're not always competing against another contractor like yourself.

    I sold an 8 x20 cooler/freezer combo recently and joyfully beat out Sysco (the food suppliers) for the equipment. Since I would have done the install either way for this customer, I had a good handle on the box and equipment costs. I was able to make a good profit and still leave nearly $1000 on the table so the customer was happy too.

    I used AmeriKooler out of Miami, consider them to be a decent quality panel and they have really good system prices. There are a lot of companies that can beat even their prices, but then I'd expect the integrity of the product to suffer.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    East Stroudsburg, PA
    Posts
    13,215
    3 grand?

    I wonder if the other guy forgot to put in for the equipment.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Camel City, NC
    Posts
    6,232

    Nothing new around here

    The restaurant suppliers sell the refrig. equip. at cost, set up the box and put equip. inside. The hook-up is seperate. I had a customer tell me I was trying to --ck him the first time I ran into this kind of pricing. He did get ----ed but not by me.
    Be safe not fast. body parts don't grow back

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Winston-Salem,Nc
    Posts
    350
    have also ran into one of these hook-ups ...installer tried to do it without permit...local inspector fixed that

  7. #7

    Re: Nothing new around here

    Originally posted by selfemployed
    The restaurant suppliers sell the refrig. equip. at cost, set up the box and put equip. inside. The hook-up is seperate. I had a customer tell me I was trying to --ck him the first time I ran into this kind of pricing. He did get ----ed but not by me.
    Same here, the biggest whores on the planet. Don't even try to compete ya just look bad. Take the service end and charge them out the wazoo.
    Hey cockroach, don't bug me!

    www.AskTheDiceman.com

    www.TheColdConspiracy.com

    www.Pennwood-HVAC.Com

    Bring Em Home....

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    22

    Smile price

    Price is not the most important factor in closing sales. If price point is the most important consideration to your client then get new clients. Do you always buy what is the cheapest, or do you look for added value. I dont know any contractors who drive base model trucks. It should be important to your client that you are going to be in business in ten years time. My point being sombody can and will always beat your best price. The wise business person will not only sell price but more importantly added value items expertise, warranty, quality, customer service maintenance contracts and the list goes on and on. Don't sell price sell your self and your company.
    Oak

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Annapolis, MD: ragboat capitol of the world
    Posts
    358
    As above, there is the lowest price and the lowest correct price for any job.

    Offer the customer quality, let them choose.

    One thing has been scarring me on some of this "budget" crap. I don't want to be standing under the evap coil the day that those plastic bolts snap ....
    Sam

    Know-it-all? Nope, not even half!

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    The "Burgh"
    Posts
    1,255
    Bally will always be the highest quality box out there, that's for sure. But they will also get competitive if you can supply numbers and info. Are you having Bally supply the equip as well ? Or pricing separate ? Semi or tin-can?

    Also, Bally has a more competitive brand, still made by Bally, with different panels and insulation, but you have to ask for it.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    NH & Cebu
    Posts
    1,608
    Originally posted by hvacprodmgr
    Bally will always be the highest quality box out there, that's for sure. But they will also get competitive if you can supply numbers and info. Are you having Bally supply the equip as well ? Or pricing separate ? Semi or tin-can?

    Also, Bally has a more competitive brand, still made by Bally, with different panels and insulation, but you have to ask for it.
    UR is supplying the equip (can). My problem is Bally goes through a rep who sells to UR. Too many people getting a piece of the pie. If UR owns Bally, why do they need a rep in the middle? Bally, UR and the Bally rep dropped their pants this morning when I gave them the facts, and I got a better price, but still higher than brand B (which by the way is also a decent box, but not the same quality as Bally).

    Nobody at UR said anything about another Bally brand. Wonder why.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    NH & Cebu
    Posts
    1,608

    Re: price

    Originally posted by oak
    Price is not the most important factor in closing sales. If price point is the most important consideration to your client then get new clients.
    Well, I agree to a point, but we're talking 3 grand on a 12k box. That's a huge difference, and a tough sell. Walk-in freezer sales don't come around every day for a refrigeration contractor. And when they do, you compete with every whore in town. Am I going to give up a service customer because I can't be competitive on a box?

    I do lots of national restaurant chains. Most buy their equipment wholesale. Should I give up servicing them because they are tightwads and cut me out of the deal? Or should I get top dollar when they call for service?

  13. #13
    Before Bally changed hands, I drove to Sparks, Nevada and toured the plant. Had lunch with one of their engineers.
    Neat people.

    I used to think they were the cream of the crop.


    But I met a salesman whose only job was to sell walk-in boxes. He opened my eyes to a lot of things about this aspect of the industry.

    He said four things to me.

    1) Bally is NOT tops. Nice but no where near close.

    2) Valued added to the sale closes more deals than price alone.

    3) Be competetive but not cheap.

    4) something is wrong with your prices if you close more than one in five bids on W-I coolers.


    I have been inside a few plants making panels. I like Bally.
    I like you can look at the model tag and order additional panels years later.


    But I met a guy who made panels out of a little shop in California. I had a Bally box. He came out and measured the existing box and custom made additional panels to fit and extend the cooler out another few feet.
    For less money than Bally.
    And his panels fit perfectly. Now that is an artist!


    RMI makes better panels. Night and day difference. But if you think Bally is high priced, you DONT even want to ask how much an RMI box is.



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