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  1. #1

    HVAC design for a nightclub/restaurant/bar

    Hi everyone. I'm looking to renovate an existing building and put in a nightclub/restaurant/bar. It's approx 10,000 sq/ft and I have 4 HVAC design/build subs telling me 4 different things on what I need.

    One is saying (5) 40 ton roof top units, another saying (5) 12.5 ton units, another saying (1) 80 ton and (3) 40 ton units.

    My question is; based on the IBC or IMC what is the required load for an occupany classification of "Nightclub" vs "Restaurant/Bar/Lounge"? I don't own a copy of either and the local library doesn't have them. (New Hampshire)

    Each sub is telling me different load requirements/ HVAC tonnage req.

    Any help would be appreciated!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Indiana
    Posts
    3,228
    not sure you would find a specific load for "nightclub"
    calculations should be based on each specific area u want to condition..how those areas are divided up and heat loads in those areas....kitchen equipment..coolers..computers..lighting both to see and show lights..sound equipment and also amount of people the fire dept will allow to occupy the space or a lesser number of aver number of people u think will be in attendance. Add on that the area of the US u are in

    if this is a large investment u may want to get a 3rd party involved i.e. architect who specialized in HVAC design

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    North Richland Hills, Texas
    Posts
    14,915
    Have you consulted with an actual engineer that has a "PE" behind his name?
    If more government is the answer, then it's a really stupid question.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    In a mechanical room....
    Posts
    1,888
    When your done with all of your fancy heat load calcs if the owners plan on ignoring the limit of persons allowed in space keep that in mind. I simply mean if it's a strip club you may want to add a few thousand btu's per person because a person just standing around is one thing, a person that is under the influence EX. On coke,Crack,Horse,Blow,Crank,Smack,Magic dust,E,Whatever the hell Else people take these days they are gonna be HOT no matter what so you better be able to point to a stat reading 70 or lower with a club at twice it's occ limit. And I speak from experience.
    “It takes courage to grow up and turn out to be who you really are.”

    - E.E. Cummings

  5. #5
    I am the owner. Occupancy is limited to 1,000 by fire code and will be strictly enforced. However I understand your point. We just don't wanna get lured into WAY over-designing the HVAC system b/c some sub thinks he can get more $$$ out of us. We want to be code compliant but not paying for the sub's new Benz or Lexus lol.



    Quote Originally Posted by chrishvacman View Post
    When your done with all of your fancy heat load calcs if the owners plan on ignoring the limit of persons allowed in space keep that in mind. I simply mean if it's a strip club you may want to add a few thousand btu's per person because a person just standing around is one thing, a person that is under the influence EX. On coke,Crack,Horse,Blow,Crank,Smack,Magic dust,E,Whatever the hell Else people take these days they are gonna be HOT no matter what so you better be able to point to a stat reading 70 or lower with a club at twice it's occ limit. And I speak from experience.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    3,824
    60 Tons.

    Get three load calcs. (free with estimate) hire a mechanical engineer (500 bucks) have him analyze each, pick the best.
    Start collecting that cover charge.
    Always here

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Northwest IN/Chicago
    Posts
    268
    I'm kinda curious that 2 of them total up to 200 tons of cooling and only one totals to 62 tons.... that's a huge difference there

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    North Richland Hills, Texas
    Posts
    14,915
    Upwards of 200 tons of cooling may not be out of line for cooling a night club with 1,000 active people in it...
    If more government is the answer, then it's a really stupid question.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Ocean Pines, MD
    Posts
    7,033
    Why not hire the engineer in the 1st place.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Indiana
    Posts
    3,228
    Quote Originally Posted by Stamas View Post
    Why not hire the engineer in the 1st place.
    he answered that in the first place....wants to get by cheep but within code. Code does not mean it is done right or is the correct size. Hire an engineer...or u will be ever calling the HVAC co. ---its to damn hot in here. Spend now or spend 2X later

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Philadelphia PA
    Posts
    2,198
    A thousand people is 500 BTUs each (half sweat) And the fresh air they need better be coming from an ERV or your going to need even more.
    Your problem is the high latent load that goes beyond what typical commercial equipment is designed to handle ( usually 25% latent)
    Your best bet is to get a real engineer to do the block loads, select the equipment (you may want to consider a chiller so you can pick a better coil and then get the contactors to bid on the same capacity / equipment choices.

    With you electric rates you may want to consider making ice at night to reduce your electric demand billing

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Philadelphia PA
    Posts
    2,198
    A thousand people is 500 BTUs each (half sweat) And the fresh air they need better be coming from an ERV or your going to need even more.
    Your problem is the high latent load that goes beyond what typical commercial equipment is designed to handle ( usually 25% latent)
    Your best bet is to get a real engineer to do the block loads, select the equipment (you may want to consider a chiller so you can pick a better coil and then get the contactors to bid on the same capacity / equipment choices.

    With you electric rates you may want to consider making ice at night to reduce your electric demand billing
    Edit/Delete Message

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    3,824
    You will have a hard time getting anyone to pin it down. You have to many variables....lights, dancing, people. Friday and Saturday will have more people than Weds or Thursday (you know what I mean) What you may want to do is get 40 -60 tons (I would go with sixty) Then set one or two extra curbs over the dance floor or an area that has the most people. This way if you find 60 won't do it....set another roof top unit on the curb that is already set and weather tight!!! Put yourself on a concentric diffuser and your golden. If you do need another unit, it will be cheaper since the curb is in and it's a piece of cake to do!!

    (Whats a concentric diffuser? Go to Walmart....and look up.
    Always here

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