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Thread: union?

  1. #53
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    Nov 2000
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    Originally posted by tinner73
    Originally posted by RoBoTeq
    Originally posted by tinner73
    CHICAGO POLICE STRIKE????? i live in chicago. WTF are you talking about??? did you mean the strike of 1894?? if you are done talking please pull your pants up.......it's coming out of the wrong end........1894...your an idiot.....really...only makes sense you work where you do.
    I see no need for your personal attack of me,
    ..and i see no need for your lying bull****.
    your calling me names or your slandering remarks of my job;
    ..but it's ok to slander my job.
    especially when you are not denying my allegation.
    i am denying them

    Of course, I may have had the wrong city in this case.
    ..oh how convienent. more bull****.
    I seem to recall the Chicago police were not allowed to strike so they called in sick instead.
    ..just to set the record straight..my father is a retired chicago policeman. 20th district. and that **** never happened.....ever. you have got some pretty big balls making these bull**** allegations. your problems is you make up bull****....well now you've been called on it. you are full of ****, sir. you sure seem to know alot about MY city. have you ever been here? probably not. you probably couldn't afford a hotel room downtown. it's all union down there. and you probably earn a peasant's wage from your wonderful company of such quality products.
    ...i'm not the type of person that would come on here and say that the non-union are all un-trained hacks. but you seem to have no problem slandering anyone who belongs to a union. do you think the "wall of shame" pics are mostly done by union installers of non-union??....pay attention as you go through the thread.......... you'll see a lot of your company's quality products in there.........explain why that is?
    Well, once again you have decided to be vulgar about attacking me personally. This is not a personal issue and I have made it clear that I don't have anything personal against anyone who works under a union.

    So, can you discuss issues without personally attacking me or not?
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  2. #54
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    chicago suburbs
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    only if we can discuss matters without your perpetual lies. where did you come up with the whole chicago p.d. story???? this is exactly how you lose any and all credibility. please no more quotes from 1903. irrelevant....stick to the present.
    FILL OUT YOUR PROFILE!!

  3. #55
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    I certainly didn't mean to make an error about such an esteemed organization as this;
    http://www.hrw.org/reports98/police/uspo52.htm
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  4. #56
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    chicago suburbs
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    apparrently the love affair with the fireman/police is now over, post 9/11. i suppose you wouldn't have a problem calling for a union policeman to come to your aid. the police/fire get the honor of seeing some of the worst society has to offer. murder, burned children, horrible accidents and the rest. and i am amazed that i am having to defend them. does the chicago pd toture people? they sure do. i believe the evil union tells them to do so, and everyone knows you must do what the union says. i'm pretty sure that you would be a good candidate for a police interview. you could explain how you think they are lazy and overpaid. explain your stance against the good-for-nothing unions. i'm pretty sure you would then need a paramedic........................uh-oh they're union too.
    FILL OUT YOUR PROFILE!!

  5. #57
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    You forgot to call me an idiot in that post. When did I say union workers are lazy? I don't believe I have posted anything about the union worker but rather about unions as an organization.

    By the way, I can have these discussions with my union friends and never have them attack me personally. Maybe they are not as easy to get to, eh?

    By the way, no, I don't call the police for anything except to write a report if needed. Unlike some, I can take care of myself.

    In my area, volunteer firefighters and open shop firefighters are much preferred over the unionized Baltimore City fire fighters who are alway whining about something.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  6. #58
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    this has grown tiresome......and we are WAY off topic.....again.
    FILL OUT YOUR PROFILE!!

  7. #59
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    Jun 2003
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    As a worker If I was going to go back and start over and I was going to not own my own company I would probably sign up in the pipefitters Union for the training they offer. If you like to fab or install duct join the sheetmetal union and if you like to braze pipe and maybe do some service join the pipefitters union they are both good. The jurys still out if I would join as a owner or if I would want to work my way up within the union to be an owner. I am a non union contractor in the los angeles area who does 95% prevaling wage work for the last few years and I am currently employing 1 Union journyman and two apprentices on two PLA jobs and 7 guys total and I have found that the union guys who take pride in there work and have a good work ethic are great to have working for me, I also have guys that are non union who are the same way but the union guys are in my humble opinion are better trained because of the schooling that they get that we didnt but you cant teach a strong work ethic. BTW if you do join the union here In LA the apprentices have one day of unpaid school every other monday and make around 12.51 plus benefits to start. As a contractor the only thing is if your going to be union or work in LAUSD under PLA or PAL you must protect your good guys and be willing at first to send guys packing who dont want to work untill you build a good crew. That takes time. If you dont have work for more than a few days you will lose your crew and then its back to square one so you MUST stay busy and as a owner this scares me. Also If you think that when you call the hall that your going to get self starters who come out and take care of everyone and everything forget it, You get what you get, some are good and some stink and If you get REAL lucky and find someone who can run a job you must pay 10% over scale for a foreman and you might want to add a truck to keep them. Also if your non union the only way that your going to get first year apprentices is if you walk them in or get real lucky, I dont know if its the same for the Union guys or not but I suspect it is. Out here the sheetmetal guys who are non union on school jobs other than PAL jobs get 44.31 an hour with .69 paid to the training fund on top with no bennies or holiday pay other than the 44.31 rate and on PLA jobs the pay is 29.93 with a pretty good package on top to total the 44.31. plus .69 to the training fund. That is also what a Union guy makes. I am not pro or anti union and what I gotta pay is just the cost of doing bussiness legally on school jobs. I was seriously thinking of going union and I might still but I may be going into semi retirement depending on how I feel after closing the last of 8 jobs over the next 2 months that have consumed my life over the last two years but I am bidding jobs next week that may keep me here for another year but I am leaving this state sooner rather than later. The Union is what it is and if your going to do good size public works type jobs you have to deal with them and it is a hassle but thats the game and because of that they will have work for many years to come. I do however take offence to the guys who want to say that mostly only Union guys can do high quality work, Please... give me a break, Plan and Spec is Plan and Spec. Its the plans, inspectors, the Mech. eng. the GC and then the insalling company that counts.

  8. #60
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    Good post raiderfan. Do those of us with mild dislexia a favor though and use some paragraph breaks

    I too ran a merit shop company that did mostly prevailing wage jobs in the DC area. I found just the opposite as far as quality of workers here on the East Coast. The union guys I had hired had some serious attitude problems about working in general whereas the merit shop trained workers I had were always grateful to be working on the military bases at prevailing wages.

    Union guys that I hired did not last long if there were normally priced jobs that had to be done. The merit shop trained guys had no problems with doing what needed to be done and considered the government jobs a bonus.

    Merit shop workers trained at organizations such as Associated Builders and Contractors, Air Conditioning Contractors of America and Refrigeration Service Engineering Society are all very proficiently trained and professional workers.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  9. #61
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    Dec 2002
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    Robo, Whats up with you and unions

    Did Jimmy Hoffa molest you as a child??

  10. #62
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    Your right, I just got started and wrote more than I thought I would.

    We have ABC and other places out here also but they do not have any sheetmetal apprentices, only plumbers, framers and electrical. If they did It would be great because getting apprentices is a big deal on Prevaling wage jobs and can make a huge impact on your job costs.

    I have found that Workers are pretty much the same on or off prevaling wage jobs, you may get about 10% more for a while on Prevailing scale but they get used to the money, I think It all boils down to your lead guy running the job right with the material coming in right and ontime and working with the other subs and the work ethic of the worker cannot be understated.


  11. #63
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    Re: Robo, Whats up with you and unions

    Originally posted by rob10
    Did Jimmy Hoffa molest you as a child??
    No, but he and other union bosses have been molesting this country for far too long.

    One of my uncles in fact was shop foreman for a large union mechanical contractor in this area when I was young. I was urged to join the union and was about to in 1972 when all hell broke loose in Maryland with the unions.

    Merit shop trailers were burned out, construction equipment was destroyed and otherwise tampered with causing at the deaths of at least 5 merit shop workers in an 18 month union rampage. There was no way I was going to join an organization that acted like that.

    During this time I was confronted with strike issues which altered the operations of the merit shop company I was working for. I was introduced to the oportunity to break through a picket line in order to deliver materials to a job we were not allowed to work on because of the union strikes. The company I worked for rearranged work schedules so no one needed to be laid off during this time but it really cost a lot of companies a lot of money putting up with the union aggressions.

    Because of the reaction of the public to the methods the unions used during this time period unions in Maryland lost a lot of credibility. The state is still officially a union state but the unions have never been able to force it to be a closed shop state in function.

    A few years later my own company was assaulted by unionizers who caused a lot of dissent with some of my employees. Most of my employees were loyal to me and the company and the union was not voted in. Those who opposed my ways of doing business left on their own accord soon after. Seems that they were plants that were sent to me for the sole purpose of unionizing my company. What a waste of time and energy.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  12. #64
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    Re: Re: Robo, Whats up with you and unions

    Originally posted by RoBoTeq
    Originally posted by rob10
    Did Jimmy Hoffa molest you as a child??
    No, but he and other union bosses have been molesting this country for far too long.

    What a waste of time and energy.
    Ever hear of triangle shirtwaist. That is what happens when the power of the greedy is left unchecked by Unions.
    A Diamond is just a piece of coal, that made good under pressure!

  13. #65
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    Re: Re: Re: Robo, Whats up with you and unions

    Originally posted by frozensolid
    Ever hear of triangle shirtwaist. That is what happens when the power of the greedy is left unchecked by Unions.
    Leap for Life, Leap of Death

    275 girls started to collect their belongings as they were leaving work at 4:45 PM on Saturday. Within twenty minutes some of girls' charred bodies were lined up along the East Side of Greene Street. Those girls who flung themselves from the ninth floor were merely covered with tarpaulins where they hit the concrete. The Bellevue morgue was overrun with bodies and a makeshift morgue was set up on the adjoining pier on the East River. Hundred's of parents and family members came to identify their lost loved ones. 146 employees of the Triangle Shirtwaist Company were dead the night of March 25, 1911. The horror of their deaths led to numerous changes in occupational safety standards that currently ensure the safety of workers today.
    Yes, this 1911 tragedy was avoidable and as stated led to the government organization that prevents these things from happening today. Unions today have absolutely no affect on such working conditions. The good that unions did in the past is no longer a factor of todays unions. Todays unions exist to support the lavish lives of union bosses.

    You really don't want to get into a tit for tat accounting of damages created by merit shop neglect vs damages created by unions do you? It is absolutely bad when people die because of bad working conditions but to deliberately murder people because they will not join your organization is a bit of a different story.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


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