I know there are more than 3 reasons, but give your top three!
Here are mine:
1-Instructors should have retired years ago
2-Course is a shotgun approach leaving you blasted
3-Hands on was too little too late using junk
Do I sense that you are just a tad unhappy with your HVAC education?
I see you are attending college in Stockton, Ca. Perhaps you should transfer to San Jose City College.
At least you said "most schools" rather than "all".
Bummed but not beaten
I am not attending school in Stockton. I am attending the IT school in Modesto CA. Almost finished and have to say that I was my own teacher for the majority of the school year. Which wasn't that bad, I'm a pretty good student.
We've gone through 4 different instructors in 8 months! Ouch. BUT, I am very optimistic about my future and am ready to learn more.
Are you referring to the $25,000 Sequoia Institute in SJ? I considered going there but the drive would've been too much. I think tech schools are a great beginning. Some just aren't that good due to administration. But by in large I would do it all over again, except this time move to San Jose!
Do NOT go to Sequoia Institute in San Jose. No I recommend San Jose City College the local community college operated by the State Of California.
I have written so much about what I think an education out to be, some folks here wont even read a thread on the subject if I have posted there .... cause they already heard it over and over again.
Do a search of this site for anything I have contributed to on the subject of "education".
Also on the subejct of "Mentor".
If it wasnt so late, I'd do it for you. But your young ... go for it.
1-teacher are not paid enough.
2-most commuity school are in the same boat as we hvac contractor,no one willin to pay for the best or can afford the best.
3- no funds.
R12 has interesting points
R12 I appreciate the search topics and found them to be informational!
The "READY ON SITE" idea makes total sense. Has anyone ever taken advantage of it?
The mentor program makes the most sense of all.
You've quite a renaissance man's experience!
If teachers do it only for the money, thats why there are few good teachers. Yes you need to get paid for what you do, but we all worked for less because we like it. Look around how many good techs? how many good doctors? how many good cops? you will find that its the same everywhere, some people care and most people just get along. remember money is the most important thing.
there but for the grace of god, go all of us
Can't beat that meathead. You hit the nail on the head.
I graduated from Sequoia in '94. It was composed of 8 six week course. The course on furnaces was taught by some white haired red neck that belonged in an Egyptian museum wrapped in bandages. We got lots of interesting book work with little in the way of meaningful classroom explanation. That would be followed up by lots of engaging lab work. Ever seen 20 standing pilot furnaces line up in a row? I have. We must have rewired the same basic setup 10 times, right after vacuuming the rust out for the 11th time. They had exactly ONE hot surface ignition furnace. We watched it go. (Ooo... Ahhh...) We didn't touch.
I know they improved things since then, but sheesh. I couldn't fix a furnace to save my life straight out of school. Maybe that's why they charge 25K now instead of the bargain basement 12 or 13 that I paid. Lucky me, they retired that hack right after I took his class.
The refrigeration instructor was especially fun. His obsession with women combined with his inability to get them (it might have been his rather comical lisp) at least made his course entertaining if not instructive. That and his "colorful analogies" made time pass by quickly. Who knew refrigeration was so analogous to human body parts?
Then there was break/lunch/dinner time. You could choose from a half dozen of the latest innovations in vending machines or from a half dozen of the latest incarnations of mystery meat from the roach coach. The convicted felon who got free tuition (no doubt getting a free ride "rehabilitates" and builds character) always seemed to have a lot to say about a lot of things at the "dinner table". Or if he didn't entertain, you could join any of the more subdued but equally foul mouthed and sexually oriented discussions at other tables. LOL!
But then came the payoff! FREE job placement assistance!
Queue the job placement assistant: "We got nothin in your area." (applause)
So I sent out 40 applications blindly on my own and got a half dozen offers in an area that had nothin.
Yeah, I'm sure I'm exaggerating. But the last thing they were producing was clean cut "technicians" that Susie Homemaker would 1) want in her home and 2) could trust to competently do the work needed. If you became a real tech there it happened because you were hungry and made it happen.
Someone post links to R-12's good stuff. I'm too lazy to search but will read them.
[Edited by Irascible on 07-20-2004 at 08:14 AM]
Dude! Sequoia was no different huh? U have got the tech school schtick down to a T! I can just see the olf furnace maestro now! And 25 furnaces in a row? Wow, I can just see it now.
And job placement? That's too hilarious! They also told us the,"Here are the want ads from the local paper, knock yourself out guy!"
In your opinion what would three things would a effective school have to have?
And yeah, alot of my classmates have spent time in the grey bar hotel! Quite a few potheads who have shown me that there are thousands of ways to use the word,"F#ck!"
And finally...The Lisp! I laughed for a godd 15 seconds! Thanks Irascible
You get what you want out of an education.I am in school now and we just had a sub for the regular teacher who was on vacation and this guy was as old as ice cubes,but he did have some old time tips which I thought were pretty good.But back to the point,it made it very easy for some of the people to use cheat sheets and that was good for them it will catch up to them eventually.Personally I dont want to get thru life just getting by.A 'B' is not good enough when I know if I work a little harder I can get an 'A'.I also check out this site to pick up what I can,get tool and supply catalogs and anything else to try to be the best I can be.I have already read ahead of the class so the info is not new to me when we go over it in class and I have a better understanding of the matl.
The funny thing is that I simply ran out of time to list everything. There was the air conditioning instructor who had worked for NASA and told you about it many times; who had helped create/invent a recovery machine that was conveniently used by the school and told you about it many times; who could do a semi-humorous stand up routine at your expense while breathing fire if you did one at his expense; was as smart as a whip, stuck up as a diva, looked like a bouncer and "corrected" his deficient peers on their inferior knowledge as though he were a bouncer.
I'll give you a theme, as opposed to three things. That would be real professionalism maintained in the school. They supposedly taught you to be professional but few acted it while learning it. The atmosphere wasn't much better than an urban high school's. We're learning laws of thermodynamics while simultaneously cracking jokes about genitalia? I don't think so. Given the young age of most of the students, all the crap going on certainly distracts from learning.
Lucky for me few are probably going to see this thread, because they'd flame me for what I'm about to say. Professionalism, ethics and morality are ALL one big fat ball of wax. If you act ethically, you'll end up being professional and moral by default. What IS professional behavior? It's treating the customer with respect, not ripping them off, doing the best work you can, using proper language... and so forth. Such professionalism sounds pretty ethical and moral, doesn't it?
And acting professional enhances the class room. All boy schools and all girl schools routinely outperform their mixed counterparts. They don't have the stresses, distractions and idiotic behavior of the boy/girl thing. In a sense they act more professional. The same goes for schools that require uniforms. Talk about all the crap, tension, etc. that goes on in school over clothes! Take away that and the atmosphere becomes more professional. The students perform better.
Force an atmosphere of learning instead of an atmosphere of jock itch and the trade schools will get better results. Enforce rules against foul language and sexual innuendo. It could be easily done under the guise of preventing sexual harassment lawsuits since there are usually a few women around. Be militant about arriving on time. Also enforce minimum dress standards (which I think Sequoia actually had). And stop giving away free tuition to criminals! They only drag the place down. The results would be no different than when you do it in high schools. Grades will go up.
Of course, you and I both know it ain't gonna happen.
Going along with what Dragon's saying:
Yes, there was a ton of good knowledge flying around. And there happened to be two tons of other crap mixed in. Like I said, if you were hungry you could come out of it with some decent knowledge. I graduated top of my class and have a worthless plaque to prove it. But in retrospect it could have easily been waaay better.
Though none of that good knowledge had anything to do with the heating instructor. He had old timey tips alright. Got a bad case of pneumonoultramicro-scopicsilicovolcanoconiosis? No sweat. Lister's Carbolic Unguent, Balsam Specific or perhaps even a curative galvanic belt will fix you right up!
(A little Simpsons action there. )
[Edited by Irascible on 07-21-2004 at 02:08 AM]