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  1. #66
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    What puzzles me is why he would change from his neutral position. He knows the polling data on topic.

    Impress muslims home and abroad, yes. But at stake 70% offense to Americans is a really big trade-off. I just don't get it.
    "You boys are really making this thing harder than it has to be". Me

    "Who ARE you people? And WHAT are you doing in my SWAMP!?" Shrek

    Service calls submitted after 3PM will be posted the next business day.

    I give free estimates [Wild Ass Guesses] over the phone.

    "I am sorry for interrupting, please continue with your quarreling" Some chick on TV

  2. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tool-Slinger View Post
    What puzzles me is why he would change from his neutral position. He knows the polling data on topic.

    Impress muslims home and abroad, yes. But at stake 70% offense to Americans is a really big trade-off. I just don't get it.
    I get it all too well. Obama is an agitator. Obama wants internal strife between Americans. A nation divided cannot stand.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  3. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoBoTeq View Post
    I get it all too well. Obama is an agitator. Obama wants internal strife between Americans. A nation divided cannot stand.
    I don't know. Take my previous post, add the new thread started by DeltaT and it just doesn't make sense to me still.

    http://hvac-talk.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=616612

    Obama is not really dividing so much in many ways. Especially with an election soon. Looks like political suicide to me. And more like he is uniting America against himself. His polling is already in the tank.

    IE

    He is really blowing his shot at a 2nd term. And the next 2 years are shaping up to be working with unfriendlies.

    Insult the right, insult the left, insult everyone, and insult everyone again. Looks like he is killing the dem majority and his own presidency.

    That all said taking everything in the picture.

    More to the particular topic: Unless there is something really, really big on the horizon involving the muslim world there is no sense in trying to appease/impress muslims at the trade-off of 70% Americans do not agree. And I will add the LEVEL of degree of disagreement is really big for some, as this is a quite emotional thing for some of those 70%. [not me] It cuts across political lines too.

    The only divisive stuff I see him pulling are the racial and immigrant and gay agenda stuff. Also obamanomics in general. As far as things that work for that purpose. The rest of it is a little hard to understand.
    "You boys are really making this thing harder than it has to be". Me

    "Who ARE you people? And WHAT are you doing in my SWAMP!?" Shrek

    Service calls submitted after 3PM will be posted the next business day.

    I give free estimates [Wild Ass Guesses] over the phone.

    "I am sorry for interrupting, please continue with your quarreling" Some chick on TV

  4. #69
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    http://www.wvinter.net/~haught/Koran.html

    KORAN commands to kill infidels:

    Allah is an enemy to unbelievers. - Sura 2:98

    On unbelievers is the curse of Allah. - Sura 2:161

    Slay them wherever ye find them and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. - 2:191

    Fight against them until idolatry is no more and Allah's religion reigns supreme. (different translation: ) Fight them until there is no persecution and the religion is God's entirely. - Sura 2:193 and 8:39

    Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it. - 2:216
    (different translation: ) Prescribed for you is fighting, though it is hateful to you.

    ..... martyrs.... Enter heaven - Surah 3:140-43

    If you should die or be killed in the cause of Allah, His mercy and forgiveness would surely be better than all they riches they amass. If you should die or be killed, before Him you shall all be gathered. - 3:157-8

    You must not think that those who were slain in the cause of Allah are dead. They are alive, and well-provided for by their Lord. - Surah 3:169-71

    Let those fight in the cause of God who sell the life of this world for the hereafter. To him who fights in the cause of God, whether he is slain or victorious, soon we shall give him a great reward. - Surah 4:74

    Those who believe fight in the cause of God, and those who reject faith fight in the cause of evil. - 4:76

    But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever you find them. - 4:89

    Therefore, we stirred among them enmity and hatred, which shall endure till the Day of Resurrection, when Allah will declare to them all that they have done. - 5:14

    O believers, take not Jews and Christians as friends; they are friends of each other. Those of you who make them his friends is one of them. God does not guide an unjust people. - 5:54

    Make war on them until idolatry is no more and Allah's religion reigns supreme - 8:39

    O Prophet! Exhort the believers to fight. If there are 20 steadfast men among you, they shall vanquish 200; and if there are a hundred, they shall rout a thousand unbelievers, for they are devoid of understanding. - 8:65

    It is not for any Prophet to have captives until he has made slaughter in the land. - 8:67

    Allah will humble the unbelievers. Allah and His apostle are free from obligations to idol-worshipers. Proclaim a woeful punishment to the unbelievers. - 9:2-3

    When the sacred months are over, slay the idolaters wherever you find them. Arrest them, besiege them, and lie in ambush everywhere for them. - 9:5

    Believers! Know that idolators are unclean. - 9:28

    Fight those who believe neither in God nor the Last Day, nor what has been forbidden by God and his messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, even if they are People of the Book, until they pay the tribute and have been humbled. - 9:29 (another source: ) The unbelievers are impure and their abode is hell. (another source: ) Humiliate the non-Muslims to such an extent that they surrender and pay tribute.

    Whether unarmed or well-equipped, march on and fight for the cause of Allah, with your wealth and your persons. - 9:41

    O Prophet! Make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites. Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end. - 9:73

    Allah has purchased of their faithful lives and worldly goods, and in return has promised them the Garden. They will fight for His cause, kill and be killed. - 9:111

    Fight unbelievers who are near to you. 9:123 (different translation:
    Believers! Make war on the infidels who dwell around you. Let them find harshness in you. (another source: ) Ye who believe! Murder those of the disbelievers....

    As for those who are slain in the cause of Allah, He will not allow their works to perish. He will vouchsafe them guidance and ennoble their state; He will admit them to the Paradise He has made known to them. - 10:4-15

    Allah has cursed the unbelievers and proposed for them a blazing hell. - 33:60

    Unbelievers are enemies of Allah and they will roast in hell. - 41:14

    When you meet the unbelievers, smite their necks, then when you have made wide slaughter among them, tie fast the bonds, then set them free, either by grace or ransom, until the war lays down its burdens. - 47:4
    (different translation: ) When you meet the unbelievers in the battlefield, strike off their heads, and when you have laid them low, bind your captives firmly.

    Those who are slain in the way of Allah - he will never let their deeds be lost. Soon will he guide them and improve their condition, and admit them to the Garden, which he has announced for them. - 47:5

    Muslims are harsh against the unbelievers, merciful to one another. - 48:25

    Muhammad is Allah's apostle. Those who follow him are ruthless to the unbelievers but merciful to one another. Through them, Allah seeks to enrage the unbelievers. - 48:29

    Prophet! Make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites and deal sternly with them. Hell shall be their home, evil their fate. - 66:9

    The unbelievers among the People of the Book and the pagans shall burn forever in the fire of hell. They are the vilest of all creatures. - 98:51

    Fight them so that Allah may punish them at your hands, and put them to shame. (verse cited in Newsweek 2/11/02)

    -------



    KORAN promises of houris in heaven:

    Single-minded slaves of Allah... will be honored in the Gardens of delight, on couches facing one another; A cup from a gushing spring is brought round for them, white, delicious to the drinkers, wherein there is no headache nor are they made mad thereby. And with them are those of modest gaze, with lovely eyes, pure as they were hidden eggs. - Surah 37:40-49

    Lo, for those who ward off evil is a happy journey's end, Gardens of Eden, whereof the gates are opened for the, wherein, reclining, they call for plenteous fruit and cool drink therein. And with them are those of modest gaze, companions. This it is that ye are promised for the Day of Reckoning. - 38:50-54

    Lo! Those who kept their duty will be in a place secure, amid gardens and water-springs, attired in silk and silk embroidery, facing one another.... And we shall wed them unto fair ones with wide, lovely eyes. They call therein for every fruit in safety. They taste not death therein, save the first death. And He hath saved them from the doom of hell, a bounty from thy Lord. That is the supreme triumph. - 44:51-57

    Lo! Those who kept their duty dwell in gardens and delight... reclining on ranged couches. And we wed them unto fair ones with wide, lovely eyes... and we provide them with fruit and meat such as they desire.... - 52:17-22

    ...Reclining upon couches lined with silk brocade, the fruit of both the gardens near to hand.... Therein are those of modest gaze, whom neither man nor jinni will have touched before them.... - 55:54-56

    Those are they who will be brought nigh, in gardens of delight... reclining therein face to face. There wait on them immortal youths... and fair ones with wide, lovely eyes, like unto hidden pearls, reward for what they used to do.... Lo! We have created them a creation, and made them virgins, lovers, friends. - 56:11-37
    (Different translation) Companions with beautiful, big and lustrous eyes... virgin-pure and undefiled.

    --------

    Koran "sharia" punishments:

    As for the man who steals and the woman who steals, cut off their hands as punishment for what they have earned, an exemplary punishment from Allah. - Surah 5:38
    You sure are cocky for a starving pilgrim.

  5. #70
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    Jun 2009
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    thank you for proofing islam is not peaceful religion.

    there shouldn't be any religious building on ground zero. or they can built another skyscraper on it, owned by the billioners from dubai, and when they blow it up again the arab world can realize that the problem is not western society, but their own ppl and extremists.

    the terrorists screw everything up. bush did make mistake too. conspiracy theory is abundant.

  6. #71
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    On another note, dont wait for the government to protect us, I live in Illinois, one of two states that dont allow some form of conceal carry.
    It dont matter to me, I started carrieing a 9 mm in my tool case. If I go in a known bad area, its under my leg as I drive. Im not waiting to get killed to wake up, and the rest of you better do the same. Now, if I can get rid of a thug by handing him a few bucks, thats a good thing, but the ones that try to pull me out of my van wont be sorry, cause they will be dead. and yes I know how to use it.
    We people had better wake up, it probably wont get muck better. I knew a contractor that took his wife and 15 year old daughter to dinner on the riverfront is St Louis a few years ago, came out of the resturant about 10 pm, couple of thugs pulled them in an alley, robbed him, bent his women over and raped them, while they laughed, and he whimpered. better wake up america

  7. #72
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    Well, our commander in chief approved of it, so much for protecting the citizens from the enemy, he encourages they to set up camp right in our boarders.

  8. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike dixon View Post
    On another note, dont wait for the government to protect us, I live in Illinois, one of two states that dont allow some form of conceal carry.
    It dont matter to me, I started carrieing a 9 mm in my tool case. If I go in a known bad area, its under my leg as I drive. Im not waiting to get killed to wake up, and the rest of you better do the same. Now, if I can get rid of a thug by handing him a few bucks, thats a good thing, but the ones that try to pull me out of my van wont be sorry, cause they will be dead. and yes I know how to use it.
    We people had better wake up, it probably wont get muck better. I knew a contractor that took his wife and 15 year old daughter to dinner on the riverfront is St Louis a few years ago, came out of the resturant about 10 pm, couple of thugs pulled them in an alley, robbed him, bent his women over and raped them, while they laughed, and he whimpered. better wake up america
    So,,,,,,,,,,,basically you saying we should,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,wake up?
    Just trying to follow you here.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OumOa...eature=related
    You sure are cocky for a starving pilgrim.

  9. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoBoTeq View Post
    Oh goody; Obama has now chimed in on this issue for the official White House stand; Very typical Muslim ploy to use the laws of a land in order to overtake that land.

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100814/...o_mosque_obama

    Just why has Obama even felt the need to weigh in on this? Once again, Obama is taking sides in an issue that can only create division in American citizens.
    Obama is taking sides with the U.S. Constitution; something that his oath of office requires him to do.

    Of course you folks wail and gnash your teeth about Constitutional freedoms being eroded but then we see that you insist that these freedoms only extend to those who share your political and religious views.



    I also question the venue in which Obama made this declaration; Have dinners commemorating other religious holidays been held in the White House? I really don't know. I have not seen anything in the news about Christian, Jewish or Asian philosophy dinners at the White House.
    Your hero, George W. Bush, initiated these dinners. Bush celebrated Iftaar with a dinner each year he was in office.




    On a personal note, I am physically ill over this man's continued support of issues that divide our nation.
    So supporting the Constitution and continuing a tradition started by your hero Bush makes you physically ill?

    Looks like your illness is self-inflicted.
    Gods are fragile things; they may be killed by a whiff of science or a dose of common sense.

    Chapman Cohen

  10. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by geerair View Post
    Obama is taking sides with the U.S. Constitution; something that his oath of office requires him to do.

    Of course you folks wail and gnash your teeth about Constitutional freedoms being eroded but then we see that you insist that these freedoms only extend to those who share your political and religious views.



    Your hero, George W. Bush, initiated these dinners. Bush celebrated Iftaar with a dinner each year he was in office.




    So supporting the Constitution and continuing a tradition started by your hero Bush makes you physically ill?

    Looks like your illness is self-inflicted.
    What a poop slinger,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,hey i gotta idea, why dont we take your posts break them down out of context or line by line one by one and type stupid.
    You sure are cocky for a starving pilgrim.

  11. #76
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    This announcement coming from Obama is really scaring me. There is no way for Obama to justify making this stand. It does not help him and it does not help Democrats. So, what is the motive?

    How about this? Barack Hussein Obama, born to a Muslim father, raised in his early years as a Muslim with a Muslim step father, claiming to be a Christian by joining an anti-American church, is catering to Muslims worldwide in order to set off a much larger Islamic war worldwide.

    Obama has put the American people in a position where economically we are owing more to China and Islamic nations then can be paid back in short order. The American people have been divided by Obama by race, by social stature and by political affiliation. We are a divided nation that owes more then it can produce. We are vulnerable to a civil war in which we could not survive.

    Since this latest grandstanding of Obama's support for Islam over a basic courtesy to all Americans can only hurt Obama's image with Americans, including those idiots that bought into Obama's idolatry image, one can only conclude that Obama is joining those who are about to wage full scale war on us.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  12. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by zachhvac View Post
    What a poop slinger,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,hey i gotta idea, why dont we take your posts break them down out of context or line by line one by one and type stupid.
    Now, now zach; people like geer have a right to their opinions no matter how stupid and ridiculously wrong they are. Without the geers of the world, Obama wouldn't have a colon.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  13. #78
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    I found this on a blog.

    There is already a grass roots movement amongst NY construction workers- NOT ONE is going to touch that building project. These rag heads are going to learn how thing are handled- NY style. You need union guys and permits and cement and iron and all kinds of SH IT to build this SH IT HOLE terrorist monument. Wait until EVERY NY "guy" who handles "these kinds of things" in NY says F U. NY construction- is TIGHT with NY cops and NY firefighters, etc - it's like "family". If these guys want- they can put up 10,000 road blocks to insure this SH IT HOLE will NEVER get built. ANY construction worker that touches this project will NEVER get another days work in NY for the rest of their life. That's how this will be "handled" in thee end.


    Looks like it's going to start a war.

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