Page 5 of 6 FirstFirst 123456 LastLast
Results 53 to 65 of 77
  1. #53
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    California
    Posts
    2,064
    Quote Originally Posted by jpsmith1cm View Post
    Phase Loss,

    Are you trying to prove a point with your new avatar photo?

    Maybe a fractionation test with 404a?

    Please post results of system performance before and after if you would be so kind. I'm very interested.

    Am I doing it wrong?

  2. #54
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    California
    Posts
    2,064
    unfortunately I will not be able to post before and after results on system performance. I was adding 192# into a 1,300# rack charge. I decided to try and charge (1) 24# jug as vapor..(BTW, it would take FOREVER) it was 85* ambient and I was charging into a -25*SST suction header. It was going for 45 minutes and I lost patients so flipped the tank and finished off as liquid.

  3. #55
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    25,418
    Quote Originally Posted by Phase Loss View Post
    Am I doing it wrong?
    It would appear that you are vapor charging from that cylinder.

    I'm SURE there is a good story behind that picture.

  4. #56
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    mid-Tennessee
    Posts
    705
    Quote Originally Posted by jpsmith1cm View Post
    It would appear that you are vapor charging from that cylinder.
    I was thinking the picture would be a good lesson for the OP on how NOT to do it. An appropriately placed picture for this thread.
    ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° °

    "You never know what others don't know." -

  5. #57
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    California
    Posts
    2,064
    Quote Originally Posted by ECtofix View Post
    An appropriately placed picture for this thread.
    the thread is the reason for the picture to be honest

    I was dumping gas in the system and thought about it.

  6. #58
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    25,418
    Quote Originally Posted by Phase Loss View Post
    the thread is the reason for the picture to be honest

    I was dumping gas in the system and thought about it.
    Daydreaming about h-talk while on the job?

    Somebody needs a life.....


  7. #59
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    MA
    Posts
    5
    Quote Originally Posted by ECtofix View Post
    I never thought of introducing a contrived restrictor setup from my refrigerant cylinder or gages to meter and flash liquid flow entering the system I'm charging. I'm going to have to try that. I won't get into the debate over WHAT would serve that purpose, but I suspect it would be something with an internal diameter that resembles a large capillary tube.

    I often DO finish a charge through the suction side by throttling my manifold suction valve to regulate flow, then monitoring WHAT I throttle into the system by observing line frost as my warning sign to throttle back the flow. Usually I'll need to do this only on larger systems, when I DON'T know the exact quantlty by weight (W/I coolers and freezers).

    Known quantity systems (reach-ins & self-contained OR remote ice machines) where there's a specified critical quantity by weight, I'll only finish through the suction side to purge my hoses and manifold to get every last drop. Most of that refrigerant would still be in a liquid state so throttling also is a prudent measure to prevent liquid refrigerant from damaging the compressor.

    For the sake of the OP, the key concerns when refrigerant is leaving it's cylinder as a liquid (upside down cylinder) and feeding into the suction side:

    1) You DON'T want it to still be liquid when it gets to the compressor. It needs to flash off (evaporate...turn to vapor) before it gets there.

    2) You're doing so because of all the new refrigerants on the market in the last 20 years. As such, you only need to be concerned about refrigerants that are "mixes" or "blends" LEAVING the CYLINDER as a liquid when charging into the suction side. You'll figure out WHICH ones with experience.

    WHY? Mixes and blends are the ones that separate if they leave their cylinder as a vapor and therefore won't be what they originally were in the cylinder OR the system when you get done. REMEMBER that mixes & blends are made of components with differing boiling points so they vaporize at different rates.

    Only a few refrigerants nowadays are NOT mixes or blends which you CAN let them leave the bottle as a vapor. This technique was a MUCH preferred and accepted practice with most of the refrigerants years ago for charging into the suction side of a system. But those non-ozone depleting HFC replacements hit the market in the '90s and complicated the trade by not only the varieties, but bytheir unusual chemical characteristics as well. Things were so much simpler before all that.

    Until you get to know your different refrigerant characteristics, stick with the "leaving the bottle as a liquid" method combined with the throttling technique. I hope you've figure out what that is by now.
    I use VIZI Vapr, it works great!

  8. #60
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    California
    Posts
    2,064
    Quote Originally Posted by jpsmith1cm View Post

    Somebody needs a life.....

    uhhhh, I do refrigeration. I gave up on a life.


    but seriously.
    I think about HVAC-Talk on the job! I apply a lot of what I read on this site to what I do in my job. I've learned more here than any school or individual has ever taught me.

  9. #61
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    25,418
    Actually, life has been getting better for me, even though I pretend to be a refer tech by day and pontificate on here by night....

    I cannot disagree that this site has improved my skills and broadened my knowledge base. It has changed the way I think about systems and my approach to troubleshooting.

  10. #62
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    mid-Tennessee
    Posts
    705
    I'm not strictly refrigeration. I entered a field in restaurant equipment repair 12 years ago after 20 years military. Currently, in the course of a month I might get half a dozen refrigeration calls.

    Going from 25 ton capacity mobile A/Cs (for ground aircraft maintenance use) to refrigeration was a huge leap. Practices there were on a grander scale but lacking the broad-based knowledge and experiences you guys learned and practice. THERE - only a few types of equipment to know and repair with any practices OUTSIDE the base's front gate mainly crossing over to automotive A/C. I was even an instructor in their electrical and A/C tech schools for a few years.

    But, I was mainly a tweak in the field, working on electric power units - so didn't even REALLY practice my knowledge in refrigeration theory until I started THIS job. Well schooled and studied for military purposes, but not much practice. Add (or subtract) to that, many things forgotten from years past.

    Nevertheless, here I am.

    I'd love to go through a modern trade school for reinforcement and to ramp up on newer technology and tools. But at 50 - I don't know.

    In the mean time, I'm fascinated with the level of knowledge on this forum. Not just books or a class or alone at a job "scratching my noggin because I never seen this happen before so who do I call" sort of stuff. I can get on here and pick other's brains with questions that haunt me...or others...and load up with know-how from other's experiences.

    A knowledge-base such as this forum is invaluable. Such a resource didn't exist ten years ago.

    Appreciate ya'll...for your dedication, professionalism and willingness to help out each other (and me) even when you're not on the clock.
    ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° °

    "You never know what others don't know." -

  11. #63
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    6,095
    Quote Originally Posted by ECtofix View Post
    I'm not strictly refrigeration. I entered a field in restaurant equipment repair 12 years ago after 20 years military. Currently, in the course of a month I might get half a dozen refrigeration calls.

    Going from 25 ton capacity mobile A/Cs (for ground aircraft maintenance use) to refrigeration was a huge leap. Practices there were on a grander scale but lacking the broad-based knowledge and experiences you guys learned and practice. THERE - only a few types of equipment to know and repair with any practices OUTSIDE the base's front gate mainly crossing over to automotive A/C. I was even an instructor in their electrical and A/C tech schools for a few years.

    But, I was mainly a tweak in the field, working on electric power units - so didn't even REALLY practice my knowledge in refrigeration theory until I started THIS job. Well schooled and studied for military purposes, but not much practice. Add (or subtract) to that, many things forgotten from years past.

    Nevertheless, here I am.

    I'd love to go through a modern trade school for reinforcement and to ramp up on newer technology and tools. But at 50 - I don't know.

    In the mean time, I'm fascinated with the level of knowledge on this forum. Not just books or a class or alone at a job "scratching my noggin because I never seen this happen before so who do I call" sort of stuff. I can get on here and pick other's brains with questions that haunt me...or others...and load up with know-how from other's experiences.

    A knowledge-base such as this forum is invaluable. Such a resource didn't exist ten years ago.

    Appreciate ya'll...for your dedication, professionalism and willingness to help out each other (and me) even when you're not on the clock.
    EC By some small chance you wouldn't happen to have a wiring diagram for a Hobart M# DN97 convection oven ?

  12. #64
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    mid-Tennessee
    Posts
    705
    Quote Originally Posted by VTP99 View Post
    EC By some small chance you wouldn't happen to have a wiring diagram for a Hobart M# DN97 convection oven ?
    Not with me but will try to get by the shop tomorrow and look. However, most of what we have is mainly parts ID info and lacking tech literature. Will see.
    ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° ° °

    "You never know what others don't know." -

  13. #65
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Winter Haven, FL
    Posts
    4,279
    Unless the diagram is on the machine, your going to have to call hobart and beg them to email it to you..

Page 5 of 6 FirstFirst 123456 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Comfortech Show Promo Image

Related Forums

Plumbing Talks | Contractor Magazine
Forums | Electrical Construction & Maintenance (EC&M) Magazine
Comfortech365 Virtual Event