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  1. #1
    I got a market with a pair of fifties. One if down. Ground shorted.

    I get to remove it and take it to the rebuilder in Austin.

    How much does that sucker weight? Is my 3/4 ton hoist strong enough for such an undertaking?


    Also, when it comes back ... what is the best sequence for re-installing it?

    Like ... should I have the suc and dis lines all bolted to it prior to the alignment process? Or should that be after the alignment is completed?

    I have never performed an alignment. But this time I get to learn.

    Inquiring minds ... want to know



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    1,311
    who is rebuilding it? If not the manufacturer i hhave heard of some instances where the compressor is no longer UL listed, if that is a problem.

    I would say alignment first. but that is my preference. have a shim pack available, and a double dose of patience.
    what is the method of coupling, flexible metal grid? align it with a dial indicator reading from one shaft to the other. rotate the shaft around and fix any deflection as you go. it is not a complex proceedure but it is time consuming when performed right. your coupling will determine how close your tolerance must be.

    the weight? i could'nt say off hand who made it?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Earth
    Posts
    4,879
    Those tolerances are no joke, follow them strictly. If your off just a little it will run, but that coupling will eat itself alive in no time. Probally at two A.M. Then you hope it did not chew anything else up with it.
    A Diamond is just a piece of coal, that made good under pressure!

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Guayaquil EC
    Posts
    10,331
    If you've never been exposed to aligning a direct drive unit before I would strongly recommend that you call in a trusted machine shop to do this for you (the first time).

    As for the rigging this beast, I again would suggest hiring a qualified rigger if you have a gut feel that it's a bit beyond your resources and capabilities.

    This is what my father did many years ago. He always said: (1)Let your tools do the work (2) If you don't have the right tool, get it and (3) If your not comfortable doing it, find someone who is. He was not one to spend an extra dollar if he didn't have to so it surprised me way back then when Dad hired the best machinist and the most expensive rigger in town......., but now that I'm at that stage of life myself, I can see such logic quite clearly.


  5. #5
    Thanks for the kind words and good advice.

    The rigging... that's not a problem. I just begun this thread to get some feedback on this particular subject.


    As far as alignment goes, if push came to shove, I could do it myself.
    But I know from experience ... there is a long way to accomplish what your doing and then there is a shorter method. The method devoloped over years of experience.


    I know what "0.001" looks like on the dial indicator. I used tolisten to my Mentor speak on the subject many times.
    It is just time consuming he said. Patience I do have for such a project.
    And I'm smart enough now to know I should ask questions before I embark on certain tasks.


    My job is to haul it outa there and have the rebuilders do their thing. Next will be my job to rig it back into place and ready for alignment.

    Once again... thanks

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    East Stroudsburg, PA
    Posts
    13,215
    Usually for a couple hundred bucks, you can hire a millwright from a motor shop that does a lot of the big stuff to come out with a laser aligner and do all the shimming and bolting for you, then the responsibility for a thousand dollar coupling coming apart in a thousand little pieces falls on them. That's what we do on close coupled open drives.

    What type of "50HP" unit is this? A Carlysle 5H, or a Schnacke-Gr*******? ( ) Or what? If it were a 5H, I wouldn't even move the thing, just buy the stuff and rebuild it in place.

    BTW, open drive compressors don't generally carry a UL listing, to the guy who was concerned about that.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Nevada
    Posts
    1,815
    Sounds like fun the patience is no joke.
    Quote
    “Engineers like to solve problems. If there are no problems handily available, they will create their own." Scott Adams

    "We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them."
    Albert Einstein

  8. #8

    Exclamation

    Originally posted by R12rules
    I got a market with a pair of fifties. One if down. Ground shorted.

    Ground shorted.?

    do you mean that the motor need to be rebuilt?

    Don't interrupt me while i'm talking to myself

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    1,311
    condenced dave

    did not know that but it did make sence, what you said that is. i was thinking semi-hermetics if that saves any face

  10. #10
    Uhhhhh..... ya see .... I been puttin in these LOOOOONG hours this week and when I made out this post ... I had just got home from yet ANOTHER service call in Austin ... and I aint been sleepin very good lately and my mind is a little foggy and some of my rememberance jus kinda ran together!

    Know what I mean?

    That direct drive compressor isnt ground shorted. Nor is the drive motor behind it.

    The unit is broken and that's all I was told.

    The ground short was a "different" compressor.

    (whew .... )

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    East Stroudsburg, PA
    Posts
    13,215
    Originally posted by hvac3901
    condenced dave

    did not know that but it did make sence, what you said that is. i was thinking semi-hermetics if that saves any face
    Why the hell do you care what I think.

    You spelled my name wrong, BTW.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Ponchatoula, LA
    Posts
    84
    R12Rules,
    Okay have had a lot of practice with 5H60 thru 120s. Worked for a private owned grocery store chain in NoCal that speced their own machine rooms and used carrier(carlysle) exclusively. We would changed them out in the field and then ship them back to be rebuilt. To you questions:

    1) We used an engine hoist to lift them, our installation shop had dollies made, thick plywood with casters, like piano dollies that we moved them around with. Usually we hoisted them up and dropped them on to the dollie to move them around.

    2) As far as alignment, the coupling instructions give you your tolerances and it is aligned after it is bolted to the bed plate, after the suction and discharge headers are installed. You align the motor to the compressor. Most bedplates have alignement studs or atleast nuts welded on the motor end for this. As far as the compressor is concerned level is all that matters. If it is the same compressor on the same bedplate use the same shims on the compressor end only, since that should bring it back to level. After the coupling is installed. If it is a carlysle then it should be a spring pack coupling. Anyway mount the dial indicator on the motor hub and read the compressor hub. Be very patient. Their are 4 areas that need aligning 2 are done with a machinist rule. You can measure the distance between the hubs top/bottom and side to side to fix the cocked alignment (radial?). Do that first. Next for side to side off and up and down high/low(axial). Use new shims for that. Whoever is your carlysle parts house should have them. A shim kit is expensive though, I think however you can buy just different packs, as a matter of fact I remember buying them from Grainger too. Our company bought a roto-aligner (laser), man talk about sweet, it would tell you where and how much and as you adjusted it would change to you were inspec. Since you probably don't have one the dial indicator is your only bet. I never knew you could out source the alignment to a machinist, but if you've never done it you might be better off that route. It's not too difficult, but I was taught while in the navy years ago and took to it real well. I have met people that couldn't align to save their lives. Heck spend the money have the machinist do it and see if he'll show you then the next time you can do it yourself. Or if you have a dial indicator, try it first and see how it comes out. That coupling will eat it self if you are out and it will happen on the weekend in the middle of the night. Hope I shed some light on it.


  13. #13
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    East Stroudsburg, PA
    Posts
    13,215
    A semilocal motor shop has on-the-road millwrights that do this sort of thing for a more than reasonable fee, using laser aligners.

    It might not be available everywhere, though.

    Look in the YP's for mobile millwrights.

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