FF lineup; what kinds of temps are we looking for in Ice Cream??? .... - Page 2
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  1. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    East Stroudsburg, PA
    Posts
    13,215
    Originally posted by refer dude 2479
    Originally posted by oly
    Might want to check for leaks after putting in 200#, or is the store to cheap to pay for a leak check. It sure would save them money in the long run.
    If you have your EPA card you know that the leak must be found and fixed. Don't give the store the option not to.........

    It could be your ass in the sling
    I can't believe someone would buy that quantity of refrigerant and not ask where it had gone.

    I never, ever "ask" to leak test. And I leak test a LOT.

    You're reading the ramblings of a guy who burns up more leak detector sensors than most large companies...

    What's a couple hundred in labor to leak check compared to tens of thousands in potential loss?????

  2. #15
    Yes I do leak check.
    This customer has a form we must fill out whenever we dump in freon. (or a blend ... for that matter).

    I work hard at finding whatever I can for leaks. I dont like the idea of dump and run.

    I also dont like surprises. And in the past, I have been surprised by a leak or two which came back to haunt me.


    (that was cute ... "if I have my EPA card")



  3. #16
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Ponchatoula, LA
    Posts
    84
    R12Rules,
    Try to shoot for -8 to -12 on glass door sets. A couple of other ideas, if there is one controlling case, make sure it's txv is leaner, so it pulls down last. Normally the stubs should be piped middle of the line-up. Does this lineup get prgressively warm the farther away from the stubs? If so I agree check the liquid level. Also check defrost, sometimes the lineup is broken into multi circuits, you might ahve an issue there.


  4. #17
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    59
    Dave, ever not find a leak! one of those that might be in the overhead, or underground. Is this not a potential for increased labor? just curious.

  5. #18
    Originally posted by oly
    Dave, ever not find a leak! one of those that might be in the overhead, or underground. Is this not a potential for increased labor? just curious.
    I'm not Dave, but I'll answer anyways. Those are more difficult to pinpoint but it can be done. Run your leak detector (H-10 in my case) at the start and end runs of that circuit. If your lines are insulated well like they should be, the gas will travel until it can escape. If it's the liquid line, look for oily areas above or stains on the floor or ceiling tiles.

    If you're still in doubt about underground linesets, cut and pressurize the s.o.b.

  6. #19
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Earth
    Posts
    4,879
    I have found leaks in overhead piping to be very rare. Most are cause by poor installation practices. The occasional rub-out from a un-saddled pipe on a hanger.

    The underground however is another story. It is more like swiss cheese than refrigeration piping. I do not believe I have ever seen a good underground system (although I have an idea for a method, I believe could be successful).

    Most leaks I have seen, have been at rack, or the case/box.
    But as I have said before, I have not seen it all either.
    A Diamond is just a piece of coal, that made good under pressure!

  7. #20
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    51

    frozen solids idea

    just reading the threads..

    whats your idea?

    dan

  8. #21
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Earth
    Posts
    4,879
    Most U.G. leaks I have seen have been rubbouts, or lime corrosion. These occur in uninsulated lines or lines that have had their insulation torn, while being pulled into the U.G tubes.

    My idea is to the encase the lines and insulation with 8 or 10 mil marine shrink wrap (the stuff they cover boats with for shipping). I believe this would make the lines easier to pull, and provide protection against tearing the insulation.

    I think both liquid and suction lines should always be insulated in the U.G. I have seen many cases where insulation was in the specs for the job, yet it was not used. Many times sleazy contractors pull the copper tube, then put one piece of rubber on each end. Giving the appearance of proper installation. Their long gone, when it leaks a year down the road.

    It would cost a little more to do this. Though It would be a lot cheaper than losing two or three hundred pounds of gas, and repulling lines.
    A Diamond is just a piece of coal, that made good under pressure!

  9. #22
    Most of the big chains here spec that all underground lines be insulated, both liquid and suction, and then the lineset is run inside of 6 inch pvc. This started about 15 years ago for stores that were buiult near the bay. (SF Bay) The salt water would leak into the soil and eat the pipe in no time at all. At first the pvc thing was time consuming, but now most big stores are doing it and the installers have gotten quick at fabbing it up. Not much pipe goes into the ground here anymore. Only the pipes that can not come from the ceiling. Another advantage of the pvc is leak checking the underground. If there is a leak there is a 6 inch hole to sniff with your leak detector, but underground leaks have all but vanished in the new stores.

  10. #23
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Guayaquil EC
    Posts
    10,249

    Underground piping........

    In the olden days, circa 1950-1960's supermarket under-floor piping was typically run in accessible, but covered trenches or else in "orangeburg". It's that old style composite black sewer pipe. There were pull-boxes every 50 feet so you didn't have any underground joints in the soft-drawn copper. This was in the New England area, so I can't speak for other areas. I think the switch HD pipe and to Schedule 40 PVC came along in the 70's and then in the 80's we were using SDR PVC.

    Anything direct buried w/o insulation was just suicidal, the insulation just prolonged the agony of eventual death. Everything alway went overhead unless it couldn't be avoided. It's just seems today the "suits" don't mind seeing boxed-in piping risers as much as they used to.

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