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05-28-2004, 11:49 AM #27Member
- Join Date
- Jul 2003
You must not have any other contactors but AB from your wholesaler. Hell they all do a good job if you do a proper pm on your equipment.
We've used all type except the el cheapo's. We have used AB before but one seems to last as long as another.
Remember that a refrigeration mechanic can do both refrigeration and heating and air but a hvac mechanic can't do refrigeration work. (a old local saying but it seem to be true at least in this area.) We have local lg AC Contractors that try to do these store refrigeration and when you get at the job all you can say is why me.
05-28-2004, 06:20 PM #28
It was cphc's post that stated he typically changes out all contactors on racks twice a year that prompted me to mention the Allen-Bradley thing. The nearest stocking distributor to me for AB is 35 miles away and has to dust off the part to read the numbers.... I don't mind though because I rarely have to go there for parts because the AB contactors just keep on working.
For R12, you want to look up the AB 500 series contactors. They have a good website at : http://www.AB.com
For pricing you'd have to contact your local distributor, but the on-line store will give you list prices. For instance, a set of new contacts for a #2 contactor (which is rated for 15 HP @ 230V or 25 HP @ 460V) is under 60 bucks list. The whole contactor lists for nearly $500.
I still think they're worth it in the long run.
05-30-2004, 08:33 AM #29Regular Guest
Originally posted by icemeister
- Join Date
- Mar 2004
I haven't picked up on any such Copeland requirement. It may be just gossip started when Copeland introduced their own line of Name-Branded controls and such. Emerson may know more about this than anyone here.
Single phasing is a common cause of 3 phase compressor failure, so replacing contactors with a compressor change may not be a bad idea. Don't know if I would do it on any particular schedule though.
05-30-2004, 10:23 AM #30
Pardon me if this has been said. Any new copeland pump of any kind, here in MI is required to be replaced along with a copeland approved contactor. Copeland will no longer warranty single phase burns either. This has been the thing here for about 6 months or so.
On the side. Contactors are so overlooked.
As for racks. I see this alot. The contractors doing stores are now saddled by this contract crap. They get so much for the service for the year to take care of a store. So say a pump burns up. They install the new pump but they may not address acid issues, such as changing oils, oil analysis. And sometimes the gas can be so bad that it should be changed but it isn't. That takes time and that takes cash. I have also been privy to how these contracts are drawn up and for the most part an electrical failure often times is not covered under the contract. So the contractor is like, screw it.
Couple that with the talent pool going down. the very good rack guys are getting fewer and fewer. They know to identify slugging, high disharge ratios and temps, superheats wacky. A maybe less seasoned tech, slaps the pump in and if he don't see anything weird right off, it's called a done deal. Seasoned rack guys will sit there and watch that rack run through it's motions. They will run those legs to try and identify a source, something intermittent. That kind of trouble shooting, I call that digging, it's not really encouraged or taught as a standard anymore in the grocery end, because these contractors are working with a fraction of the money they use to get. Can't blame them. The customer is getting what they pay for.
R12 I think almost every post you have made since going to work for the grocery contractor down there has been fun to read. I think your seeing first hand the reason why things are going downhill in the commercial refrigeration end. Your a guy that wants do a good job, and I have no doubt your boss wants you to too. But it all boils down to money.
These corporate idiots think they can just make you concede down to nothing and still be macgyver. In the days of old, although it's always been that money struggle, it's never been this bad in the stores. It's having an impact all over the country. I hear this a lot. "It'll come back" . True proffesional mechanics all over are sitting and waiting for the better times to come back. I don't think so. I don't think the grocery refrigeration contracting business will ever be as lucrative and as esteemed as it once was. We as a niche in the industry have allowed the manufacturers, and the corporate world to run right over us. I am not sure we could have done anything to prevent it, I am just observing whats happening.
I love to hear Dave Bush speak about what he's doing in PA. I enjoy it because I see a small guy in the stores doing well. But I also think Dave is as sharp as they come as far as keeping his ear to the railroad tracks, and he is not sitting there staying only with the grocery thing. Thats his gig right now, but he is smart enough to be diversifying and if it goes too south he has himself positioned to where he eats another day doing HVAC and other kinds of refrigeration. Unfortunately too few grocery contractors have done such a thing. Some are trying to as we speak, some think in the past and beleive it will come back. Some can't even see it at all.
I urge anyone that does grocery work as a technician to prepare themselves for other disciplines in the industry. Start now by understanding more about HVAC, smaller commercial refrigeration. Industrial work. Controls.
And thats the incredible thing. It's been so good for so long, that a refrigeration guy, he only had to know racks and work a million hours a year. It's changing very fast.
Sorry to go long. Just some thoughts about whats what. I have very close ties to the grocery side of this industry and have been around it my entire life. I have known some very outstanding people by way of that association. When ever I get the chance to speak with these types. This is what I hear. This is what I am seeing.
05-30-2004, 10:57 AM #31
Dow you are so right on the money. We can only hope that once the talent level drops low enough, these tight ass market people will wake up.
I have personal experience in exactly what you are saying. I will start a new thread to explain my experience's, so I don't take this one to far off it's subject.A Diamond is just a piece of coal, that made good under pressure!