out of ideas

[ACFIXR]

A panel schedule would be nice ( plan/actual installation)

[timebuilder]

........................still pondering........

[tipsrfine]

I may go there wednesday, depending upon another job wrapping up in an efficient manner and light emergency call status.

I will record and post all electrical data, but if it is a power factor issue, i'm not sure how to identify it...................

Any suggestions? Dare I ask?

It's still tuesday.

[timebuilder]

It's still tuesday.

It's Wednesday. Maybe we will hear something tonight.






Or not.



.

[tipsrfine]

Hear something about what? I'm sure I have no idea what you're talkin about.

[fruecrue]

Didn't make it yesterday but leaving to go this morning, be there at 7 am.

[timebuilder]

(....drum roll...........)

[monkeyman#1]

[Octopus]

I can't take the suspense!



Ok yea I can lol

[Airmechanical]

could of been caused by solar winds



.

[fruecrue]

AHEM....Attachment 69332


NUFF SAID?

[stebs]

now i'm no expert, but isnt that power factor on the low side?

P.S. What meter is that?? I need to get one of those!

[fruecrue]

Today's voltage reading was 253.6, up from 246.9. Amp draw was around 14, Power factor was around .38-.44, measured at the contactor load side.

Recent history in house- bar fridge failure, compressor and circuit board warrantied by manufacturer's rep. Boiler pumps, pool exhaust fan and brand new hydraulic motor for pool cover all whine with a very high pitched harmonic noise. Dryer vent booster motor intermittently fails.

The PF (as pictured in previous post) was defended by installing electrician to be biased because of close proximity to inductive load(blower motor). He plans to move his data recorder to main service next.

At this point, I have stepped aside and will let customer and electrician sort out their issues.

Stebs, this was the data recorder(not mine), I wouldn't mind having access to this thing either.Attachment 69342

[timebuilder]

Yeah, that PF needs to be dealt with.

Bingo.

[Mongo and me]

In pondering, I see that a lot of other equipment is crappin (thats a field term used to desribe a higher level of pondering) out. With that said, (let me adjust my pondering bucket) one would prepare for a battle with the local power supply company. Due to the lenth of the recent pondering, my coffe has gotten cold, so I'm up for a reheat and then back on the bucket !!

"One can not lead, if one does not know were to go."

[tipsrfine]

AHEM....Attachment 69332


NUFF SAID?

Not "Nuff said" for me. Hopefully you will be kept in the loop when the cause of the low power factor is determined, i.e., due to inductive linear loads or sinusoidal non-linear loads. That meter is not a watt meter designed for non-sinusoidal current reading.
So far my research is indicating that both will result in low power factor readings. Now I'm trying to learn what key differences in effects these different conditions create in order to maybe determine what is in play in this and furture instances. So far the only difference I'm seeing is that inductive loads will produce a phase shift between voltage and current whereas non-sinusoidal loads will "really screw with the sine-wave"(my words) and will affect current more rather than voltage. The inductive phase shift problems apparently cause voltage spikes and drops, but can be corrected with the use of capacitors, but the distortion to the waveform by non-sinusoidal loads can only be corrected with "filters" that only allow the correct waveform through. I understand about harmonics and its main effect being in current build-up in the neutral in a single phase 120v, but I'm not seeing how it is not also lowering the power factor overall even in a phase to phase 220 system.
The one thing that as stood out so far is the fact that a low power factor created by phase shift from inductive loads is that it can be corrected by use of a capacitor, but that a low pf caused by harmonics not only cannot be corrected by a capacitor but that it can be worsened through the use of the capacitor.
If all of these motors use capacitors and are burning out... . I am still researching as to whether the low pf created by non-sinusoidal loads would only be present in the 120v loads.

[6010]

This can be corrected by a filter. Usually a combination of capacitors and inductors tuned to the harmonics that are causing problems.

[tipsrfine]

I just learned (don't say it") that the new cfl lights ALL have little rectifiers in them that convert ac to dc and have a crappy power factor. Isn't America supposed to be completely switching to these? What effect is this going to have on power supplies? I don't know-still researching.

[Pneuma]

I wish I uderstood power factor better than I do, that aside for now, is there a meter taht reads PF, or what readings could have been taken to check power factor? Could the low PF have been found with a fluke 116 and an clamp meter? I shoud have googled rather than posted... here is an extech that reads PF http://www.testersandtools.com/Extec...lamp-Meter.php

[tipsrfine]

This can be corrected by a filter. Usually a combination of capacitors and inductors tuned to the harmonics that are causing problems.

These cannot filter the harmonics created by non-sinusoidal loads.