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Thread: Playing plumber

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    ohio
    Posts
    73








    This is why I am not a plumber.
    Sewage transfer pump in one of our older restaurants in a historical district.
    Restrooms are below sewage lines so pump is required.
    I spent the morning of Christmas eve replacing pump and plumbing.
    Human waste and toilet paper floating in bottom, could not imagine doing this everyday.

    [Edited by Boss on 12-29-2003 at 05:26 PM]

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    13

    Hmm

    Great Pictures.........I think I'll now pass on those Christmas Brownies tonight!

  3. #3
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    25
    keeewwwllll looks like some of our messes... call me next time.. 867-5309 ask for Jenny

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Florida's space coast
    Posts
    2,538
    No thanks. I'll just stick to a/c.
    We've been doing so much,for so long,with so little, that now we can do almost anything, with nothing at all.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    southeast USA Occupation:HAVC tech
    Posts
    552
    are they brown trout swimming in the hole?
    AJS
    _______________________

    Always tell the truth and you never have to remember what you! said!

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Southern MN
    Posts
    259
    do i see some corn for the brown trout floating in the swimmijng hole?

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    10

    No true plumber did that!

    Obviously in a state/town without a plumbing code or inspectional services. I'll bet that the whole bathroom is illegal, right down to the location and public access. never mind that the "sump" is illegal. That "sump is nothing more than a wastewater ejector pit and a Zoeller M-57 sump pump. It isn't even a grinder pump. Don't they have a board of health? Or does a=everyone live by the good ole boys plan. Don't make waves. Do employees wash their hands in this place?

    I wouldn't have touched this problem with anything unless it was to rip it out under a inspectors order and make it right. If you fix it, and someone or something happens later, you are responsible. CYA boys, CYA.

    CMG

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    ohio
    Posts
    73

    Re: No true plumber did that!

    Originally posted by cmgordon
    Obviously in a state/town without a plumbing code or inspectional services. I'll bet that the whole bathroom is illegal, right down to the location and public access. never mind that the "sump" is illegal. That "sump is nothing more than a wastewater ejector pit and a Zoeller M-57 sump pump. It isn't even a grinder pump. Don't they have a board of health? Or does a=everyone live by the good ole boys plan. Don't make waves. Do employees wash their hands in this place?

    I wouldn't have touched this problem with anything unless it was to rip it out under a inspectors order and make it right. If you fix it, and someone or something happens later, you are responsible. CYA boys, CYA.

    CMG
    The pump that was existing was a zoeller 267 sewage pump, original install was by a major plumbing company, the original prints for the remodel here were submitted and approved by the proper city divisions (many years ago) and the location has been and is randomly inspected. This is in a major city in Ohio not some backwoods city.
    Being in a historical district any time any major work is done the city inspectors are on site.
    There were no pics included of public or employee restrooms so half of your statements are without any foundation.
    As I said I am not a plumber so there may have been a better way to do the sewage pit, I dont really know. But it did pass city inspections.


  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    10

    Sewer Pump/Pit:

    I understand about such things. But it doesn't matter where it is located. There is NO code in existance that allows raw sewerage to be drained into an open sump to be pumped into a building sewer/drain. It may drain into a sump, designed for such purposes with a air tight cover, properly sized and properly vented to the outside. That usually means that a vent must be installed into the cover (which must be air-tight. That pump may be a #262, but it looks like a m-57 to me. Sewerage pumps usually have 2" discharges, M-57's have a 1 1/2" discharge. And I'll take your word that it is not a M-57. But I don't have a Zoeller pump book with me at this time. Most codes also require that a sewerage sump pit receiving waste from a bathroom that needs a pump to be sized large enough to receive the amount of waste in a certain amount of time if there is a power failure so as not to overflow. They also usually require some kind of a high level alarm. I only see one wire going down to the pump. And I won't even get into the disease danger factor.

    I worry about these things all the time. I run into a lot of really dangerous things in my travels. I carry a CO detector to stick into crawl spaces etc. where there is a possibility of CO being present. I have seen a lot of things in my time in these trades that had I photoed them. could take center stage on "The Wall Of Shame". I am constantly amazed amd amused at the ingenuity of hacks and DIY'ers when it comes to doing things to suit their needs.

    But you guys have to remember something about me. I say a lot of things with tongue in cheek and laughing out loud. For example, that picture of the heater in the truck. It's a classic. But I don't see anything wrong with it. It could be patented. It is the perfect portable job site heater, cleverly adapted to heating that house. The heater has a permanent home in the truck, which COULD be registered and used by someone in an emergency to heat a home that had a failed heating system until it could be replaced. A really clever guy (like the guy that came up with that one) could do some rigging so that the whole thing, ladders, tarp and extension cords could be all stored on the truck or towed by a trailer. He could take it to a home show and show it off. He might possibly get a few orders for one just like that. I like problem solvers. That person is a true problem solver.

    CMG

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Iowa
    Posts
    322

    Thats correct....

    It should have a gas tight lid, and vented. I always installed them with a valve on each side of the check valve and union...not a code requirement, I'm just anal....

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    ohio
    Posts
    73

    Re: Sewer Pump/Pit:

    Originally posted by cmgordon
    There is NO code in existance that allows raw sewerage to be drained into an open sump to be pumped into a building sewer/drain. CMG
    Im sure your right concerning present day code, the plumbing was originally done in the 70's and has probably been grandfathered since this is a historical district.
    As I said im not a plumber, I got sucked into this one because the float supposidly was sticking and causing problems, the district manager for this area decided the plumber that kept coming out to fix pump didnt know what he was doing so it fell in my lap.
    I replaced the 267 (yes it was a 267 and it did have a 2" disch.) with a BN 282 and installed an zoeller high water alarm.
    I will check into replacing cover with a air tight cover, and while I was looking at the zoeller website I saw the 840 grinder pumps i am going to check into.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    10

    Sounds good to me. You sound like a

    better plumber than the plumber before. Common sense isn't a monatary value.

    If you get the float that has the double plug on it, you can rig it up as an alarm with ease. Hang the bulb in the pit above the pumping water level and plug it into a light or bell. The switch plug into a recepticle. Then, if the thing doesn't come on, the alarm will go off letting someone know the pump isn't working.

    Another thing about this application, they should have signs p[osted in the bathrooms about "If you didn't eat it first, don't flush it down." That means absolutely no feminine hygene products. Especially white mice. The tails jam those things up right pronto. And hand towels. Also, they tend to go septic and the solids collect on the top, the pump removes the liquids. Then, the solids hang up the float switch. Small diameter tanks are prone to such things.

    I'll have to get out my digital camera and post some really fine exhaust vent jobs I see. Really scary.

    CMG

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Jersey Shore
    Posts
    28

    Thumbs down home brew ejector

    Please do your self a favor, and give the owner a proposal for a new ejector pit with two pumps and an alarm. Also from the looks of the photo a floor sink is needed to pick up the misc. drains and drips to the right of the pit. Don't try to fit an air tight cover to the existing pit... for with out a vent it will go into a vacuum and pull the water seals out of traps leaving them dry allowing sewer gas to enter the building. Unfortunately for you you have stumbled upon a hazardous mess. By the looks of the black mold on the sheetrock the rotten 2x4 bottom plates this has been going on for awhile. The corroded power receptacle looks shakey to. I get my share of jobs like this and the only way to get through this is to charge lots of money and do it right. If the owner refuses move on but keep a copy for your file, and mail another to town hall. Give them notice, no grand fathering here clearly a hazard. By the way the other plumber realy dropped the ball here, shame on him.

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