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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    106

    Honeywell Ax Supervisor Help

    I have installed several stand alone Jace's in the past but this is the first time I have needed to install multiple on the same job. I have the main building which has about 12 spyder lon controllers,20 vav's and 9 Lon vfd's, and then the seperate parking structure which has the chilled water plant. I was going to put one for the chiller plant due to it not being connected to the building, and one in the building.

    I ordered the small building supervisor for up to 3 jace's. I have not received any info on it yet so i was wondering how the binding works between jaces. Do you just use a wizard to install multiple Jace stations onto the supervisor station?

    As far as bindings between jaces, do you have to proxy points out into the supervisor station, and link them on the niagara network? Or can you somehow directly bind between spyder controllers that are served to different Jaces?

    Also how does the scheduling work betweek the supervisor and Jaces?

    Is it possible to use one Jace on the Chiller plant, and for the main building just install a station on the supervisor. This would elimate the need for the second Jace in the building. I heard that this was a feature that was going to be offered, but not released.

    If anyone has any documents on this it would be helpful, i have been trouble finding anything online. I could not find info on the supervisor on the buildings forum.Only thing i have is more of a quick start guide.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Charlotte, NC
    Posts
    419
    When you have more than one jace on a network, you'll have to setup each one specifically to fit the network its on. Chances are, you'll have to get with the IT department at the building to assist with getting that together. (I.E opening ports, generating ips', etc.) When you get that done, you'll use the Niagara Station Manager to "discover" your other jaces on the network. If everything is right, your other jaces should show up. You just import those in, then you have access to do any Jace-to-Jace bindings, and also discover points. If theres not going to be a web server, then it would be best to have any and all graphics on one jace, to keep from having to link back and forth. If its the first time you've ever done this, then its alittle more difficult than I make it out to be, I just wanted to give you an overall summary of the things involved.

    Hope this helps!

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Near Philly
    Posts
    500
    Also how does the scheduling work betweek the supervisor and Jaces?

    The schedules are created in the supervisor workstation, then imported into the individual Jace. Once imported, link the schedule to the points in the Jace. Trends can be done in the opposite direction, so they can archive on the supervisory workstation.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    106
    This job does require an exensive amount of history to be collected also. Does this automatically happen by adding history extensions in the Jace, or is this something you add to the proxy point in the Supervisor?

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Near Philly
    Posts
    500
    Quote Originally Posted by droptchevy View Post
    This job does require an exensive amount of history to be collected also. Does this automatically happen by adding history extensions in the Jace, or is this something you add to the proxy point in the Supervisor?
    Once you install the sup software you will see a history icon with up and down arrows on it. It allows you to discover trends on the other jace machines. It collects the trend data on a daily basis (adjustable). If the collection does not occur a retry trigger is fired every 15 minutes until success. Its useful because of host LAN downtimes and failures. If you directly collect with the supervisor, which you can, gaps will occur during LAN downtimes. It also reduces some traffic on the LAN. I just looked at one of ours the other day. It collected at 6:30 AM it was set for 2:00 AM, the LAN was down for 4 1/2 hours. The drawback is the trend data is always a little old. The end user has to be trained on how to force a collection. I'm an FX guy, I hope this isn't an appliance feature.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Fort Worth\Dallas, Texas
    Posts
    1,694
    Go to niagara central and create an account. You will find plenty of info there.

    Unless things have changed you will need the Jace inside the building to bring the Lon network in because I dont think you can license a Supervisor to run a lon network.

    If it was me I would try to get the lon out to the remote building so you could just use one jace, no more controllers than you have one jace 600 will work fine. Or you could do wireless lon or get an Illon 600 or a Loytec lon to IP router (which i believe runs its own confige server) and then just buy the lon over IP driver for the jace inside.
    Go Rangers!

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    106
    Quote Originally Posted by lwarren View Post
    If it was me I would try to get the lon out to the remote building so you could just use one jace, no more controllers than you have one jace 600 will work fine. Or you could do wireless lon or get an Illon 600 or a Loytec lon to IP router (which i believe runs its own confige server) and then just buy the lon over IP driver for the jace inside.
    You mean just one Jace and the Supervisor? I would need the supervisor for history archiving.

    I had considered running lon out there that but i was considering bus length. It is four stories of vav's, plus the roof. Ill have to estimate the length.Many more Vav's will be added later for tenant build outs, but it would be a completely seperate job so i could bid another Jace at that time.

    One possibility would be to run the lon to the chiller plant and install two lon cards in one Jace to seperate the Bus. Do you think that is the cheaper in cost and labor rather than installing a lon to ip router?

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Fort Worth\Dallas, Texas
    Posts
    1,694
    Quote Originally Posted by droptchevy View Post
    You mean just one Jace and the Supervisor? I would need the supervisor for history archiving.

    Yes, that is what I ment.

    I had considered running lon out there that but i was considering bus length. It is four stories of vav's, plus the roof. Ill have to estimate the length.Many more Vav's will be added later for tenant build outs, but it would be a completely seperate job so i could bid another Jace at that time.

    Well obviously you would need to plan this out for the future build outs. I would probably try to put one jace for now in the middle of the building and run Lon cable out to the plant.

    One possibility would be to run the lon to the chiller plant and install two lon cards in one Jace to seperate the Bus. Do you think that is the cheaper in cost and labor rather than installing a lon to ip router?
    If there are going to be a bunch more VAV's added later I would probably not do the two lon cards on the one jace, but rather add another jace later. If the money is already in the job then just add the second one now and separate your network for future expansion.
    Go Rangers!

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Phoenix, AZ
    Posts
    256

    Jace and Sup

    droptchevy

    First you can bring in the lon devices on a Web Sup, as well as any other. Here's the catch, you have to license the Sup for the driver and buy blocks of points. Or you could license to Sup as a soft jace. The money will work out the same. Stick with 2 jace's and the web Sup.
    As stated the niagara network works very well. However it can be a pain when setting it up.
    To give you an idea how well it works, I have a site with 55 Jace's on it. I have all the graphic on it. Trends are imported, alarms are sent to it and schedules are sent out from it. No problems what so ever.

    GregF

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