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  1. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    2,793
    Quote Originally Posted by hidalgo1301 View Post
    Do you use it? Has it been beneficial to you? I ask just because I want the knowledge as well as to be able to be a benefit to the company that is willing to purchase this software.
    It gives peace of mind and helps produce happy customers...a winning combination.

  2. #15
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    4,379
    Quote Originally Posted by hidalgo1301 View Post
    We do residential replacement and remodels.
    So how do you presently size your systems?
    Make your expertise uniquely valuable.

    Make your influence uniquely far-reaching.

  3. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    67,923
    Guess he thinks he can tell how much air is coming out of the register by feeling with his hand also.
    Contractor locator map

    How-to-apply-for-Professional

    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

  4. #17
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    4,379
    Quote Originally Posted by beenthere View Post
    Guess he thinks he can tell how much air is coming out of the register by feeling with his hand also.
    Your rite, get the manual J out of the way and that pesky manual D gets in the way.
    Make your expertise uniquely valuable.

    Make your influence uniquely far-reaching.

  5. #18
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    425
    I have not done a sizing of a new remodel, only of existing equipment. I have worked my way from installation to service, and have had more questions than answers on airflow and sizing equipment. It is pretty much the rule of thumb world around here. I don't have the experience, nor feel it proper to give a rule of thumb answer when sitting down with a homeowner on an estimate. I have really pushed after this summer giving estimates against other companies and not having the knowledge to give proper answers to questions. I can be very convincing, and could just "sell", but I feel that a homeowner is trusting me to do my best and give them professional technically sound advice. So..like I said I guess I will have to keep pushing. I really enjoy the company and people I work for and with, and believe that they want to give the best product possible. I just want to try to improve the process.

  6. #19
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    4,379
    Quote Originally Posted by hidalgo1301 View Post
    I have not done a sizing of a new remodel, only of existing equipment. I have worked my way from installation to service, and have had more questions than answers on airflow and sizing equipment. It is pretty much the rule of thumb world around here. I don't have the experience, nor feel it proper to give a rule of thumb answer when sitting down with a homeowner on an estimate. I have really pushed after this summer giving estimates against other companies and not having the knowledge to give proper answers to questions. I can be very convincing, and could just "sell", but I feel that a homeowner is trusting me to do my best and give them professional technically sound advice. So..like I said I guess I will have to keep pushing. I really enjoy the company and people I work for and with, and believe that they want to give the best product possible. I just want to try to improve the process.
    Go here http://www.acca.org/store/category.php?cid=2

    Buy Bob's house for a couple of bucks, read it and then give it to your boss.
    Maybe he will then buy Manual J, D, S and RS. Guess what your on your way to a never ending education. Congrats.
    Make your expertise uniquely valuable.

    Make your influence uniquely far-reaching.

  7. #20
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    425
    Quote Originally Posted by jimj View Post
    Go here http://www.acca.org/store/category.php?cid=2

    Buy Bob's house for a couple of bucks, read it and then give it to your boss.
    Maybe he will then buy Manual J, D, S and RS. Guess what your on your way to a never ending education. Congrats.
    Thanks, I'll check it out. Oh, these guys don't seem to think subcooling, superheat, static pressure reading are worth checking on a regular basis..I'm out for the night fellas, thanks for the input and keepin my head up.

  8. #21
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    SC
    Posts
    20,677
    Quote Originally Posted by hidalgo1301 View Post
    I am in the process of convincing the company I work for the value of using load calculations and having software to assist in this process. I was discussing this with a tech today, and he began telling me this is all going to be a waste of time. "No one uses this stuff anymore, and I can tell you the cfm for a room just by looking." So..he got me wondering is it worth taking the time to learn to do proper load calculations? Does everyone here actually perform these calculations, or just feel they are important? He made the case that the time spent to perform a load calc. would not have good return was just not worth the time....
    If a proper Manual J heat load calculation is performed, it can save your butt in a lawsuit.

    That idiot tech friend of yours is a hack. You can tell 'im I said so.
    No reserve. No retreat. No regrets.

    For those who have fought for it, freedom has a sweetness the protected will never know.

    http://www.airwarvietnam.com/16thSOSGunners2.jpg

    Proud member of KA Club

  9. #22
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    SC
    Posts
    20,677
    I used to live in Dallas and know the relative humidity is much lower there than here on the SC coast. If we oversize a system here, the first summer will see us replacing the system because of a major mold problem. A half ton over is usually not a problem but any greater difference than that is begging for a problem.
    And with the new "sealed foam envelope" homes these "green" contractors are building, it is VERY easy to oversize.
    Last edited by bootlen; 09-23-2009 at 10:45 AM.
    No reserve. No retreat. No regrets.

    For those who have fought for it, freedom has a sweetness the protected will never know.

    http://www.airwarvietnam.com/16thSOSGunners2.jpg

    Proud member of KA Club

  10. #23
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Beatrice, NE
    Posts
    2,067
    The firt thing you need ot understand is doing a load calc and doing one right are 2 different things. Around here half of the dealers do load calcs but most of those don't take the time to check insulation values, actually measure opening sizes, etc. Here is a good example of why load calcs need to be done. I did a new house, 2700 sq ft ranch, full basement with a walk-out to the north on the long side of the house, 3 ton, system has been in over 8 yrs with no problems. Other side of the coin, 800 sq ft house, full basement, leaky windows, 3 ton, not enough room in the house for 3 ton worth of air, squezed in 2.5 ton, system is short when it gets over 95*. That's why you do load calcs!!!!

  11. #24
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    New Mexico
    Posts
    5,496
    Before there were computers there was a calculation sheet of paper. They might have even been a little faster as you didn't have re enter into a computer. You really don't need software for loads but the print outs are impressive and maybe less math errors.
    Compare the sales benefit of a load calc compared to the contractor that scribbles a number on a piece of paper.
    About 1979 I was working for a contractor and building a house after hours. They were breaking in a sales guy and he did a load off my plans and I got this impressive load calc along with a bunch of other stuff all nicely printed out. I knew the world had changed.
    Maybe why a lot of contractors don't want to do calcs is if they only get 25-30% of their bids it seems like a waste of time.
    On a commercial building there is little choice but to do the calc.
    Tracers work both ways.

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