Chiller Brands

[Marvolus]

My company has been a faithful Carrier customer. However recently we have noticed a decrease in customer support and even worse, service parts obsolete within 5-10 years of purchase. We are now faced with adding additional chiller capacity. I believe we will consider other than Carrier. Who is the undisputed best air cooled chiller (200ton)? I noticed that the local hospital uses a German manufactured chiller. I did not notice evidence that it was frequently repaired (wire clippings on the ground, marks on the pad from refridgerant cylinders, cover screws worn from removal).

[triggerhappy]

Something made out of the country would not be on the top of my list.

One word for you "Trane".

[Dallas Duster]

My company has been a faithful Carrier customer. However recently we have noticed a decrease in customer support and even worse, service parts obsolete within 5-10 years of purchase. We are now faced with adding additional chiller capacity. I believe we will consider other than Carrier. Who is the undisputed best air cooled chiller (200ton)? I noticed that the local hospital uses a German manufactured chiller. I did not notice evidence that it was frequently repaired (wire clippings on the ground, marks on the pad from refridgerant cylinders, cover screws worn from removal).

What kind of parts are you referring to ?

[heavymetaldad]

still getting service parts for 19c's (38 years old), and we just got a pair of wheels for a 17cb (35 years old - see avatar)

[jsherhvac]

Trane is the only way to go.

[turbovac]

we have many air cooled chillers & the trane air cooled rtac is the only
way to go. [in my opinon]

[ChillerWisperer]

Ditto on Trane. Preferably a low pressure machine. It will last practically a lifetime if properly maintained.

[heavymetaldad]

still partial to carrier. they were built indestructible

[heavymetaldad]

except the schrapnel in the avatar

[jayguy]

oh god here we go again.............


standard pat answer:

find out who is the best service company in your area..."best" is a very general term here. best parts availability, best service tech knowledge/response, etc. what is "best" for you may not be "best" for someone else. the only reason i bring this up is because for warranty (most of the time) and parts/technical help you will have to go to the factory office in your area to get that info. there are many service technicians that are not with a factory office that can do a very fine job but you asked about equipment/parts and that means working with the local factory office (at some point in time).

all manufacturers work hard to produce the best stuff and every manufacturer says they make the best stuff.

at the end of the day, what is best in your area may be different than in my area.

i prefer trane myself in general. for a very specific answer, it depends on exactly what type of equipment you are installing.





and last but not least...every piece of equipment installed that was too big or too small or cheaply installed or low bid or or or or....never works for crap. get it engineered correctly and get 3 bids, take the middle bid or high bid. you will not be sorry.


i will now kick the soap box over to some other people

[Healey Nut]

Hopefully this thread is not going to turn into a " lets bash the other guy" thread
Naturally im biased but ..... "its hard to stop a Trane"
Jay quit kicking the soapbox its gettin all busted ?????

[zw17]

Another vote for Trane.

What you saw was most likely a Kraus chiller at the hospital, they are used specifically to keep the helium bubbles in MRI machines cool. They are a well built unit and I have been lucky to work on one, I say that sarcastically, they are a royal pain, parts availability is a joke, and it's hard to find techs that are willing to even work on them.

If I never saw another Kraus in my life I wouldn't be sad.

[Randy S.]

What is well supported in one town may not be in another.

Isn't R123 going away in a few years?

[chiller rob]

Trane has always had a great product...
Carrier Aquaforce chiller as of late have been good...
Yorks in the smaller scroll package are agreeable...
I am not sure on the York Latitude variable speed screw...

The chiller i have my eye on now is the generation 3 Smardt air cooled chiller...
They just got out of ARI certification testing and they are claiming iplvs in the 0.57 kw/ ton range (which is remarkable for an air cooled)...
With the extended condenser option they have a fan package (which are all on vfds standard) that only go to 45 hz to keep the sound level down around 80 or so db...
Liquid line recievers to ensure liquid to compressor motor cooling and sporlan exvs...
Available 5 year warranty on the machine or just the oilless turbocor centrifugal compressors...
Excellant for variable primary chilled water flow...

i would highly recommend that there be a quality service company to partner up with if you consider this product especially for a critical load application as these units can be tricky if the technician is not familiar with the oil free technology...
I also would not install in high ambient locals... keep it to areas that only get to 95-100 ambient...

hang on to your wallet...

i just priced a 125 ton unit and they were double the price of the trane... but i think when people take a close look at the energy savings and the sustainability, they will get more popular and the pricing should come down...

If the utility company will give you 45K (0.16 cents/ KW process load) to install one of these guys and you have your energy savings on top of that... its eye opening...

Chiller Rob

[Dallas Duster]

Here`s another way of looking at it. Look at all the threads started in the chiller forum and see which manufacturer has the most problems.

[turbomaster]

Here`s another way of looking at it. Look at all the threads started in the chiller forum and see which manufacturer has the most problems.

True dat!!!

[turbomaster]

We will be faced with the same decision in a few years. I don't really have a warm fuzzy feeling about any of the major players out there. I've seen them all do their thing and watched the good, the bad, and the ugly. What it boils down to is the reliability, support and parts in YOUR area. You will find this is not the same country wide. Good Carrier support in one area may be not so good in another. Same goes for Johnson and the big T. If you have good relationships with a certain distributor or good contacts with a certain manufacturer then go with that. Some machines are better at certain things than others too. Do your homework, ask people in your area what they think about so and so. Call up the mechanicals and ask them what they think and who they do buisness with. Call up your local engineering firms etc.
Make an informed decision. Obviously Carrier has put a thorn in your side. Call them up too and tell them what you think, go to the top if you need to. It's the only way you will get any satisfaction.
The way I look at it is if somebody pisses you off, give them a chance and if they still piss you off... well then it's time to piss on them!

[zw17]

Here`s another way of looking at it. Look at all the threads started in the chiller forum and see which manufacturer has the most problems.

That is a very unfair way to judge chillers or anything else in life....

What if Trane is 90% of what is out at our accounts, it's only logical that 90% of the threads would be about Trane chillers. Doesn't mean they have the most problems.

[Dallas Duster]

That is a very unfair way to judge chillers or anything else in life....

What if Trane is 90% of what is out at our accounts, it's only logical that 90% of the threads would be about Trane chillers. Doesn't mean they have the most problems.

I never mention any manufacturer at all , but somehow you did. Look how the OP was investigating oil stains , screws, and strips of wire on the ground. Is that a better way of judging a brand? I can repair equipment and not leave alot of evidence too!

What about the guys on this board that have 90% Carrier or 90% York etc?

[triggerhappy]

The question about which brand gives the best service.

I can not say that it is 100% accurate but I have found that government agencies with alot of resources tend to do audits on their equiptment.

These are done by pro. companies that take into account % of equipt., age and the whole lot.

If you have any connection to your local school system, or government maint. shops they will probably share an audit with you.

I recently saw one that had been done on a school system with over 400 schools and I was happy with what brand came out on top.