Stop Using 15% solder? Ridiculous cut back idea!

[AtoZhvac]

I would like everyones thoughts on this.

A friend of mine got an email from a company executive and it reads like this.



"DO NOT pick up 15% solder anymore. You should only be using 5% or 6% solder ONLY."



The company does commercial AC and refrigeration and supposedly to add to the absurdity if you buy 15% then they deduct it from your pay check.

I know in my own experience 410A systems NEED the 15% solder and on joints that already have 15% on them mixing in another solder is a call for disaster.

What do you all think of this outrageousness?

[Mr Chesapeake]

I don't see what the big deal is on using the stuff. Don't they have mark-up for welding supplies that are charged to the customer?

[cehs]

I say THAT commercial company is WRONG, and will regret it later.
Anyone who thinks that stay-bright or 5-6% is good enough is just kidding themselves.
It has been my experience that ONLY 15% or better will hold up for more than 10 years.

Maybe they are looking for out of warrenty business.....

[Tool-Slinger]

Agreed. Foolish. Given the cost of freon and labor vs. the cost of solder, one warranty leak on a commercial size charge will destroy any savings. Not so much outrageous, as foolish. An accountant making service decisions?

[Joe Cool]

I would like everyones thoughts on this.

A friend of mine got an email from a company executive and it reads like this.



"DO NOT pick up 15% solder anymore. You should only be using 5% or 6% solder ONLY."



The company does commercial AC and refrigeration and supposedly to add to the absurdity if you buy 15% then they deduct it from your pay check.

I know in my own experience 410A systems NEED the 15% solder and on joints that already have 15% on them mixing in another solder is a call for disaster.

What do you all think of this outrageousness?

Sounds like you work with a bunch of bean counters to me.

[mark beiser]

Well, if all the fittings are a good tight fit, there really isn't a "reason" to use 15%.
The main benefit to using 15% is that it has much better gap filling properties than alloys with lower silver content. The joint strength and vibration resistance is pretty much the same.

Other than that, 15% is marginally easier to flow around a joint, but that is about it.

I only buy 15% mostly because I only want to have to keep track of one brazing alloy, but also because I hardly ever see a refrigerant pipe system where EVERY joint is a nice tight gap free fit...

[beenthere]

5% works on R410A systems.

Doesn't flow as well as 15%. So takes a little extra care.

Lots of 5 and 6% joints out there for 15 and 20 years that don't leak.

I prefer 15%.

[Bubbleheadski]

5% works on R410A systems.

Doesn't flow as well as 15%. So takes a little extra care.

Lots of 5 and 6% joints out there for 15 and 20 years that don't leak.

I prefer 15%.

LOL... color me stoopid! :d
I didnt even know there was a 5 or 6 percent animal!

[beenthere]

Apparently, made down to 2%.



http://www.harrisproductsgroup.com/c...loys.asp?id=31

[Tiger93rsl]

There are other brazeing rods on the market that contain little or no silver with the same tensil strength as silver. Blockade is one of them it is a Phosphorous/copper brazing alloy with silicon it contains no silver. I used it for awhile a few years back when it first came out. It didn't flow as good as silver but it did the job with the same strenght as silver and was a lot cheaper than silver rod.

[jpb2]

Sorry gents 15 is the best but Stay Brite is better than a braze joint that was not drifted.

[Texas-Tech]

I only use 15% when sticking copper to brass, 5% works just fine if you know what your doing.

[Bubbleheadski]

I only use 15% when sticking copper to brass, 5% works just fine if you know what your doing.

thats just it... I never was trained on how to braze..... Just picked it up myself with a limited amount of "just do this" help!
so..... I guess I dont know what I am doing!

[ACFIXR]

I like to use lead, because it flows quicker

[madhat]

Any company I've worked for including present, when they let the "bean counters," tell us how to do the job, profits take an immediate nose dive. Several companies went bankrupt or were caught in the nick of time.

Where I work now, in facilities, the amount of energy we waste is incredible, all because anything we want to do has to go thru them.

[troyorr]

The 15% silver rod has been the industry standard for HVAC/R. Using a rod containing phosphorous is not recommended for steel because it can make the steel brittle and cause fracturing of the grain structure of the steel. This thread prompted me to check my brazing stock. I still have 54 1oz rods of 45% silver. I love the flow characteristics as well as the appearance of this rod. Price isn't a factor because the cost is figured into the estimate.

[troubleshootin]

I prefer using 15% beacuse it had become almost universal for a/c joints. If you begin mixing different alloys you heat some until the burn and can cause real problems with the joint or the system via impurities. Also think about different fluxes if they were used. If the tech is more comfortable with 15% and had a higher success rate i say let him go for it.