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  1. #1
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    250 ton water chiller

    Hi
    We need about a 250 ton water cooled chiller to replace our existing 300 ton York water chiller. The experts tell us that the 300 ton is too large.

    I am told that the Mcquay 250 ton is the best energy efficient chiller out there today.

    Is this correct? Any other brand equally as good?

    thanks,
    jim

  2. #2
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    Oh boy ... this is going to be interesting
    I will save my thoughts till later ??????????
    The toy chest is officially full ... I got a new toy..... 2007 Aston Martin V8 Vantage and yes it still gives me goosebumps
    You bend em" I"ll mend em" !!!!!!!
    I"m not a service tech.. I"m a thermodynamic transfer analyst & strategic system sustainability specialist
    In the new big shop , greasin', oilin' . tweakin' n shinin' !!

  3. #3
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    Get the McQuay WMC (turbocore) chiller.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by jas2239 View Post
    Hi
    We need about a 250 ton water cooled chiller to replace our existing 300 ton York water chiller. The experts tell us that the 300 ton is too large.

    I am told that the Mcquay 250 ton is the best energy efficient chiller out there today.

    Is this correct? Any other brand equally as good?

    thanks,
    jim
    And who told you this?

  5. #5
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    Thread Starter
    the enginering co. that services our York chiller in san antonio.

    thank you,
    jim

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by jas2239 View Post
    the enginering co. that services our York chiller in san antonio.

    thank you,
    jim
    I would imagine that they are a McQuay rep, or would really like to sell you a McQuay chiller for some reason known only to them. If you want to find the most efficient chiller, call the manufacturers sales offices and get the reps to give you the energy usage spills. Pay more attention to part load than full load, because that's where you'll be running the majority of the time. Spec that once it's put in and running, they do a commissioning test and prove capacity and efficiency, whoever the mfg is.

    Best??? Put 'em all in a sack, shake it up, and turn it upside down. In their own way, they'll all hit the ground about the same time - as long as you stick with reputable mfg. You need to look at future maintenance costs, also. Some mfg's are much more proud of their parts than others, and you will buy parts. Who has the best support service in your area, or is there a really knowledgeable independent service contractor where you are.

  7. #7
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    You need to think about more than just efficiency??
    What about proven engineering ?
    Reliability?
    Noise levels ?
    Maintenance costs ?
    High pressure/ low pressure ?
    Theres a whole lot more than just efficiency to consider .
    The toy chest is officially full ... I got a new toy..... 2007 Aston Martin V8 Vantage and yes it still gives me goosebumps
    You bend em" I"ll mend em" !!!!!!!
    I"m not a service tech.. I"m a thermodynamic transfer analyst & strategic system sustainability specialist
    In the new big shop , greasin', oilin' . tweakin' n shinin' !!

  8. #8
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    Sep 2002
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    Hampton Roads, Virginia
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    Quote Originally Posted by jas2239 View Post
    Hi
    We need about a 250 ton water cooled chiller to replace our existing 300 ton York water chiller. The experts tell us that the 300 ton is too large.

    I am told that the Mcquay 250 ton is the best energy efficient chiller out there today.

    Is this correct? Any other brand equally as good?

    thanks,
    jim
    What is your actual load? It would seem to me that if a 300 ton is too large even running close to fully unloaded that a 250 ton may still be too large for your real needs, as already said look at the part load efficiency as well, but for the best efficency know your exact load and size the chiller for that.

    Kevin
    "There is plenty of room at the top because very few people care to travel beyond the average route. And so most of us seem satisfied to remain within the confines of mediocrity." -- Benjamin Nnamdi Azikiwe, first president of Nigeria

    "It's not the customer's job to know what they want." -- Steve Jobs

  9. #9
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    Thread Starter

    new water chiller

    Hi Kevin,

    How do I determine "exact load"?

    Is that where an engineer does a load test?

    jim

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by jas2239 View Post
    Hi Kevin,

    How do I determine "exact load"?

    Is that where an engineer does a load test?

    jim

    What are you cooling? is it comfort cooling or process cooling. With comfort cooling a load calculation on the building should give a figure to work from. If it's a process cooling application find out how much heat needs to be rejected and what can be done to reduce the peaks of that load. For the money you will spend on a 250 ton chiller, the money you should spend on a professional design the system will be well spent.

    Installing the wrong size chiller either too large or too small would be a costly mistake.

    Kevin
    "There is plenty of room at the top because very few people care to travel beyond the average route. And so most of us seem satisfied to remain within the confines of mediocrity." -- Benjamin Nnamdi Azikiwe, first president of Nigeria

    "It's not the customer's job to know what they want." -- Steve Jobs

  11. #11
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    Thread Starter

    250 ton water chiller

    I am cooling an office building.

    If I am correct that a chiller is most efficient running full capacity, or full load, wouldn't it be better to be a bit undersized rather than oversized? Meaning that - theoretically - if 250 tons was needed, a 240 ton would be better. I know there likely isn't a 240 ton, but it's the concept here that I am after.

    In your opinion, is there a "best" 250 chiller on the market? (York, mcquay, Trane, etc.). I am seeking the most electric savings.

    thanks,
    jim

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by jas2239 View Post
    I am cooling an office building.

    If I am correct that a chiller is most efficient running full capacity, or full load, wouldn't it be better to be a bit undersized rather than oversized? Meaning that - theoretically - if 250 tons was needed, a 240 ton would be better. I know there likely isn't a 240 ton, but it's the concept here that I am after.

    In your opinion, is there a "best" 250 chiller on the market? (York, mcquay, Trane, etc.). I am seeking the most electric savings.

    thanks,
    jim
    What you need to have done is:
    1) An up to date load calculation on the building.
    2) Based on the chiller size needed from the load calculation, have various chillers performance plotted on a graph against the degree day profile for your region, that way you can see which chiller will give you the overall lowest energy use over a full year of operation.
    3) Decide if that chiller is the right one for you, can you get it serviced by a fully qualified local company? what is its life expectantly? Is the refrigerant used in it likely to be avaialable in 10-15 years? and many other questions, some of which have already been asked on here

    Changing any chiller, particularly when changing the size of the chiller should not be undertaken lightly, there are many other considerations to take in to account. Pump size/GPM's, recovery capability after outages, noise level, maintenance requirements are just a few.

    Be looking at full life cycle cost not just energy usage, and you seem to be focusing on full load energy usage, which propably is a lot less than 20% of operating time.

    This is not a DIY project, you should be PAYING someone to select the right equipment for you.

    Kevin
    "There is plenty of room at the top because very few people care to travel beyond the average route. And so most of us seem satisfied to remain within the confines of mediocrity." -- Benjamin Nnamdi Azikiwe, first president of Nigeria

    "It's not the customer's job to know what they want." -- Steve Jobs

  13. #13
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    I agree with them.

    I also must stress to find out who services what in your area. None of them are overly complicated by any means, but guys who are comfortable working on stuff perform better when they are in their comfort zone.
    "If you call that hard work, a koala’s life would look heroic."

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