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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Toronto, Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    147

    Does position of TXV bulb matter?

    The TXV bulb on my Goodman SSX14030 a/c was installed in the "4 o'clock" position of the suction line.

    The tech who installed it explained that for suction lines upto 3/4" the bulb should go in either the 4 or 8 o'clock position while larger lines should have it installed in either the 10 or 2 o'clock position.

    The tech left all documentation including installation manuals. The TXV installation instructions specifically state that the bulb should be installed in the 10 or 2 o'clock positions without mention of suction line size.

    Are there any issues with not installing the bulb in the 10 or 2 o'clock position as the documentation calls for? Does it affect the TXV's operation?

    Also, the section of suction line that the bulb is installed on is not horizontal (it's on an angle). I have read that it should be installed on a horizontal run of suction line. Does this matter?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Norfolk, VA
    Posts
    85
    Most definitely needs to be on a horizontal run.

    As far as the placement, I've always been of the 4 and 8 o'clock school. If the manufacturer recommends 10 and 2 o'clock, well......that is where it goes.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Toronto, Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    147
    Quote Originally Posted by CerealKiller View Post
    Most definitely needs to be on a horizontal run.
    What happens when there is no perfectly horizontal run close enough? In my situation, the suction line is on a 20 to 30 degree angle to horizontal where bulb is installed. I'll try to attach a photo tonight.

    Also, the bulb was simply taped to the suction line using electrical tape and covered it with insulation. The installer took the banding straps included with the TXV with him. Will this affect its operation?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    1,956
    It should be secured with the supplied bands, insulated, and should be located where oil in the line won't affect it's operation.
    "Hey Lama, hey, how about a little something, you know, for the effort." And he says, "there won't be any money, but when you die, on your deathbed, you will receive total consciousness." So I got that goin' for me, which is nice. - Carl Spackler

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Norfolk, VA
    Posts
    85
    Quote Originally Posted by john_ertw View Post
    What happens when there is no perfectly horizontal run close enough? In my situation, the suction line is on a 20 to 30 degree angle to horizontal where bulb is installed. I'll try to attach a photo tonight.

    Also, the bulb was simply taped to the suction line using electrical tape and covered it with insulation. The installer took the banding straps included with the TXV with him. Will this affect its operation?
    It will not affect operation now, but the electrical tape will likely give way over time and the bulb will come loose. He really should have used the clamps that come with it. Do not use a regular hose clamp as dissimilar metals is bad. Find some perforated strips of copper at your local home improvement box store and brass fasteners.....or have him come back and do it right!

    Post the pic if you can. Good practice is to plumb the pipes.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    11,847
    Quote Originally Posted by john_ertw View Post

    Also, the bulb was simply taped to the suction line using electrical tape and covered it with insulation. The installer took the banding straps included with the TXV with him. Will this affect its operation?
    You, shouldn't have to do anything, but call this guy back.
    It's an unacceptable install,period.
    Why would he not use the straps?

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    The Twilight Zone
    Posts
    2,964
    Quote Originally Posted by the dangling wrangler View Post
    Why would he not use the straps?
    His teenage son is using it as a nose ring.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    11,847
    Quote Originally Posted by gary_g View Post
    His teenage son is using it as a nose ring.
    He sounded like a decent tech, until I read the part where he taped the bulb to the line.
    He took the time to explain things to the customer, but kinda dropped the ball after that.
    Go figure.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    25,386
    Quote Originally Posted by the dangling wrangler View Post
    You, shouldn't have to do anything, but call this guy back.
    It's an unacceptable install,period.
    Why would he not use the straps?
    Agreed.

    Do it right the first time.

    Call the guy back.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Toronto, Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    147
    I attached a couple of photos. As you can see there is no horizontal section of suction line that can be used (unless I put the bulb inside the plenum). What's the best option?

    I'm not inviting this guy back. He "forgot" to install the TXV when he put in the new furnace and a/c. I realized it several hours after he left the installation and called the owner who does the sales end. First he suggested it was installed inside the plenum to be hidden. I had my doubts and peeled back the seal around the suction line to check. Sure enough it wasn't there.

    When the tech came to install the TXV, he collected the refrigerant in the condensing unit, installed the TXV, pulled a vacuum, and released the refrigerant back into the system. He checked that it cooled and that was it. I asked about checking subcooling and superheat and was told he didn't have the proper gauge with him and that it wasn't required. I spoke to the owner later and mentioned this to him and he claimed it wasn't required. I even had to install the "beer can" insulation around the TXV as the tech left it for me to dispose of.

    As for pulling a vacuum, he pulled it to -30 psi which is all his gauge went to. Is this adequate for R410a? The manual calls for going down to 250 micron, but I'm not sure if it's the same as -30 psi.

    Actually at the initial install they never check subcooling or superheat, but only looked for cold air coming out of the ducts. As for the furnace there were no checks for temperature rise or gas pressures. Again only checks that hot air came out of the duct. The blower fan speed wasn't set and when I asked about it I was shown the page in the manual that shows what speeds are available and how to make the adjustment. I could figure that out myself, thank you very much.

    Can I take the tape holding the bulb off and use a plastic tie wrap to hold it on? I thought about the tape eventually drying up and not holding it on tightly.

    I found another Goodman dealer who sounds very good (now that I actually know what should be done in a proper installation). I'm going to have him come in September for an annual service where he will check things like subcooling, temperature rise, and gas pressures for me. From what he said on the phone I'm going to have him come annually.
    Attached Images Attached Images   

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    11,847
    Maybe I missed something.
    Is this a new install?

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Toronto, Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    147
    The installation was done a month ago. The installer came back a week and a half later to install the TXV (the fixed orface was installed initially even though a TXV was on the quote).

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    11,847
    Most times I go to bat for the contractor.
    Can't this time.
    I feel you need to get a complete job. This isn't.
    You're too mellow. Call them back and ask them to complete the job.
    Bet you completely paid them. Ask 'em what the deal is.And when can you expect to be made whole.

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