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  1. #40
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Atlanta
    Posts
    4

    MC1, TX1, SBC and GX Manuals

    Does anyone have a link to the user/programming manuals for MC1, TX1, SBC and GX?
    Mike

    Quote Originally Posted by davem View Post
    Those types of replacements (Sage to Tridium) go well when you know Auto-Matrix hardware. If you don't know all the attributes that lie underneath the Current Value, or how the controller schedules work, or how the control loops are addressed to correspond with the outputs, you'll end up fighting the controller - so do your homework!!

    And if the Sage is running any programs, make sure you can emulate those functions. Some programs can be emulated simply by linking two objects together (which requires a custom program in the Sage if the points lie on two different PUP networks) - others can be emulated through regular Tridium objects...as sophisticated as SPL is, I've been able to get every SPL program I've run across ported over to Tridium with a minimum of fuss...

    Or keep the Sages - provided you don't lose a hard-drive, those things run incredible amounts of controllers and points with nary a hiccup. But dapper is right on the money - AAM's existing software sucks for trending and alarming, although the graphics can do just about anything you need, as long as that's all you need (although setting schedules is a little kludgy too...).

    It looks like AAM has re-invented the wheel again (their corporate history is all about re-starts, from a software perspective - in less than 20 years, they've used four different GUI's (Mouseview, Spectra, Auto-Pilot, then they finally "discovered" Tridium)) with Aspect being the latest and greatest front-end. If you're not a dealer, then it may not be available to you, so perhaps the Tridium route might be to your liking - but find out if Matrix is going to be supported by AAM for any length of time (or simply buy the PUP driver with a WEBS controller or a JACE (if you have access to the Vykon channel)) - there's no need to rely on AAM to support your front-end of choice, given that their track record shows that they'll forget all about it in 4 or 5 years anyway. To be fair, some of the changes in software platform were as a result of PC technology advances (Mouseview was DOS-based, after all), but they never really developed any of the Windows packages to a fully-functional software suite. Once they finally got to Tridium, several years after forward-thinking people finished the PUP drivers (for the r2 stuff too!), they've moved on again...

    But you'll like the hardware, once you get to know it - like Reaper said, hearty and reliable.

  2. #41
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    4,284
    Quote Originally Posted by snowm0811 View Post
    Does anyone have a link to the user/programming manuals for MC1, TX1, SBC and GX?
    Mike
    You have mail.

  3. #42
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Denver PA
    Posts
    31
    I could use a copy of that.
    Thanks Ken

  4. #43
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Baton Rouge, Louisiana
    Posts
    3,805
    Could I get a copy please
    Quote Originally Posted by MatrixTransform View Post
    very soon it is you that will be pwned

  5. #44
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Hampton Roads, Virginia
    Posts
    1,556
    A copy for my library would be appreciated.

    Thanks

    Kevin
    "Profit is not the legitimate purpose of business. The legitimate purpose of business is to provide a product or service that people need and do it so well that it's profitable."

    James Rouse

  6. #45
    If possible, could you please send me the link or a copy for our referrence. Your help is appreciated.

    Thank you,

  7. #46
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Northern NY
    Posts
    121
    I also could use a copy. Currently working with a site where I think some TX01 have been wired wrong since day they were installed.

    -Jeremy

  8. #47

    AAM SAGE to JACE Integration

    I need Help! I posted this else where, but thought someone within this thread could help.
    Has anyone out there setup a JACE on an American AutoMatrix Network with existing SAGE Units still in operation? I have a customer that has ask for exactly this as Phase I of his upgrade.
    I was able to look at the SAGE Unit using ADAM and confirm that all 4 ports are setup as PUP Networks 9600/8/1/N.
    What setting do I need to change in the SAGE for it to allow the JACE to set on the same network and see the same points?
    I also confirmed that the JACE has 4 network cards all setup with the PUP Drivers.
    Can it be done? I believe it can, just really not familiar with the SAGE Units at all.
    I have tried to contact AAM with no luck so far?

    Thanks for the help.

  9. #48
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Northern NY
    Posts
    121
    From my limited experience you can have 1 master type device on the network, either the JACE or the SAGE but never both. Maybe there is a way to make the JACE act as a slave style device and exist but I am not aware of the setup for that.

    -Jeremy

  10. #49
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    173
    By default the Sage & PUP devices do not use token passing but it can be enabled. If setup for token passing then there is no sole master and you could have the Sage and Jace online at the same time. This would be a setting on the PUP driver in the Sage as well as all of the field devices. I am with some AAM people today and will ask them to verify it.

  11. #50
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    1,445
    Osiyo is pretty sharp on that line.

  12. #51
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    163
    any chance I could get those reference manuals? Need some more late-night reading material.

  13. #52
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    1,331
    Quote Originally Posted by BMSdude View Post
    I need Help! I posted this else where, but thought someone within this thread could help.
    Has anyone out there setup a JACE on an American AutoMatrix Network with existing SAGE Units still in operation? I have a customer that has ask for exactly this as Phase I of his upgrade.
    I was able to look at the SAGE Unit using ADAM and confirm that all 4 ports are setup as PUP Networks 9600/8/1/N.
    What setting do I need to change in the SAGE for it to allow the JACE to set on the same network and see the same points?
    I also confirmed that the JACE has 4 network cards all setup with the PUP Drivers.
    Can it be done? I believe it can, just really not familiar with the SAGE Units at all.
    I have tried to contact AAM with no luck so far?

    Thanks for the help.
    Well .... I've sure as heck never tried to do a replacement of a Sage with a Jace the way you're trying to do it. And I've done a lot of Sage replacements, with Jaces or AspectFT systems.

    Technically a person could do something along the lines of what you suggest, tho I sure as heck don't know WHY you'd want to do it that way.

    Leave the Sage as is, put Jace on a port as an irresponsible peer ... with a non-conflicting network ID ... that way it won't try to seize the token. Put Jace's network ID on Sage's list of peers. Periodically, in accordance with settings you selected, Sage will pass the token to Jace, and allow N number of transactions.

    Pretty much the same procedure you'd use to let any other PUP controller on line and give it the token periodically so it could play Master and send or fetch information.

    <Shrug> Never done it that way. Wouldn't do it that way myself. But it should be quite doable. It'll have lousy results. Both will be really slow in fetching or sending data. Which may or may not have adverse results on overall sysem operation. No way for me to know as I have no details of the system setup, how many controllers are on line for each port, how much of the control routines resides at the field controller level as versus at the Sage level.

    Typically we'd pre-set up a Jace, and just cut over everything at once. Or, if a larger and more complex installation, we'd do one port at a time. Leaving Sage intact. Pre-setup Jace for one port at a time, pull designated port cable from Sage and plug into Jace. Verify everything is working, tweak and adjust as necessary. If it takes more time than we have, i.e. more than an 8 hour day, remove cable from Jace and plug it back into Sage for over night.

    Switching from a Sage to a Jace (or an AspectFT system) isn't just all that complicated as long as one does one's homework and verifies how the existing system really is operating, who's doing what and how, etc.
    A site where I stash some stuff that might be interesting to some folks.
    http://cid-0554c074ec47c396.office.l...e.aspx/.Public

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