Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 13 of 16
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Upstate New York
    Posts
    799

    Ideas on electric water heater night rate or regular ?

    Ok I would be curious IF anyone knows for sure an answer to this ?

    Opinions are welcome too !

    I have an 80 gallon elect water heater in my 2 person home. It is on a day/night meter. Heats between 11 pm and 7 am on a third leg of the meter so no timer is required.

    My bill runs around 70.00 in summer and about 80.00 in winter. Its a cheaper rate at night but I believe I pay a little more for the meter ??

    I now have Natural Gas to my new furnace. I have no real good spot for a chimney for the WH but could go with a direct vent adn run the PVC out the back of the house.

    Now what is the CHEAPEST option.

    1) leave current system alone

    2) go with a 40 gallon and chg meter to a regular day meter

    3) go with a NG forced vent pvc heater

    Now I assume the NG option would cost much more for the tank. The 40 gallon tank would be the cheapest I would think but would my bill be higher going back to a regular day meter ?

    I keep the 80 gallon set at 120 degs and we seem to be fine on hot water for the day.

    I have asked the gas and elect company and they seem to think my current set up is the cheapest.

    Ok lets open the phone lines !

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Tucson AZ
    Posts
    166

    If it ain't broke.......

    Don't fix it!

    Anything you do is going to cost several hundred dollars, and the payback will probably be less than ten dollars per month, if there is any payback at all.

    Best bet might be to make no changes until you have to replace the water heater because it fails from age, then look again at the cost savings from changing your electric utility billing by dropping the day/night deal, and the prices for electricity and gas - both will have gone up, but maybe by different amounts - then see how it looks.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Upstate New York
    Posts
    799
    I should have added that the WH is a 1990 Craftmaster brand. I will probably not chg anything UNTIL it has to be replaced. I assume it will probably need replacing sometime soon.

    I think I will stay with elect but would a 40 gallon day rate be better than an 80 gall night rate ?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Upstate New York
    Posts
    799
    Im waiting for "beenthere" he usually has the scientific skinny on these issues.

    Also this WH has the flex ss waterheater lines from the top of the heater to the supplys. I have heard both pros and cons on these. These have never leaked a drop ! I had the flex copper before and it developed pin hole leaks.

    Some plumbers have said these flex lines ( SS ) are code in soem areas and have to be used. These are made for wh use nd seem fine whacha think ?

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    67,761
    Gas water heaters have a higher standby loss then electric water heaters.

    So gas would probably cost you more to use.

    It depends on what your monthly charge is for the meter, and how much of a reduction you get on the night rate. As far as would a smaller electric water heater and going to normal rates for it be cheaper.
    Contractor locator map

    How-to-apply-for-Professional

    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Upstate New York
    Posts
    799
    I knew you would arrive,lol

    I know the charge for elect goes from .12 pkh on day to .08 on night rate so its not a meter chg I pay a little more than the average person for my day use but less for night. Basic service chg is 15.00 per month.

    Again my bill is around 70.00 in the summer until i turn on my AC that is but even then no more than 95.00

    I questioned NYSEG about going to a 40 gallon and chg the meter to a day only and they said it would cost more because the tank would cycly during the day when elect was more money ?????

    Sounds liek an Obama answer

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    67,761
    They are right. As far as it will have an on cycle or 2 more during the day.

    How many, depends on too many factors to know for sure.

    If everybody else pays 10 cents day or night per KW, then you might break even with a 40 gallon. Or just getting a regular meter.

    Do you get the night discount on everything, or just the water heater.

    If just the water heater, then a regular meter, would probably save you. When you use the A/C.
    Contractor locator map

    How-to-apply-for-Professional

    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Upstate New York
    Posts
    799
    Jim. no the night rate is for everything due to it is a third leg off the meter so at 11:00 it switches to the lower set of dials. So when they read it the lower set of dials is the night rate.

    I am sure this saves me in the summer nights when my AC is on. But at night we really dont use that much elect anyway. I guess the dehumidifier and fridges, furnace etc so....?

    I know if I went to a 40 gallon on the nate rate I would probably run out of hot water. If we both take a shower in the AM do loads of clothes and other things. Sometimes I will take another shower at 6pm and it will still be quit warm but not boiling hot so a 40 gallon night probably wont do it

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    67,761
    Take your electric bill.

    Write down the total KWs used.

    Multiply that by what the normal rate is. And see if it comes out cheaper.
    Then what your current bill is.

    If not. Then stay with the 80 gallon and dual rates.

    If it is cheaper. Then a just switch to the regular meter.

    Keep in mind, that a 40 gallon, doesn't give you a full 40 gallons of hot water to use.
    Maybe 35. The fresh cold water coming into the tank cools down a few gallons while your tapping hot water.
    Contractor locator map

    How-to-apply-for-Professional

    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Upstate New York
    Posts
    799
    Jim, not sure if I have this right, wouldn't a 40 gallon wh use less KWH's than an 80 ?? I used 760 KWH's doing YOUR calculation I am cheaper now but again wouldn't a 40 gallon take less KWH's ??


  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    67,761
    If you use 120 gallons of hot water a day.
    An 80 and a 40 use about the same amount of electric.
    With standby loss, being the only difference in amount of electric used.

    They both will use the same size electric element.

    If a new 40 has the same insulation as your current 80.
    The 40 will have to come on quicker(more often) to maintain water temp.
    The 80 won't come on as often, but will stay on longer to maintain temp.

    A new 40 gallon with a higher insulation value around the tank, will use a little less then your current 80 would.

    But, it may, or may not store enough for your water use.
    2 showers and wait for it to regenerate the whole tank.
    If the tank has to be raised from 60° to 120°, thats over an hour. to regenerate the whole tank.

    Its the little details like that, that can get you.
    Contractor locator map

    How-to-apply-for-Professional

    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Upstate New York
    Posts
    799
    Jim, Given all the options, what would YOU do if i have to replace down the road

    1) keep 80 on day night

    2) go to NG direct vent

    3) go to 40 on regular day rate

    Thanks AGAIN Jim !!

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    67,761
    I'd stay with the 80, and day night rate.
    Contractor locator map

    How-to-apply-for-Professional

    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Comfortech Show Promo Image

Related Forums

Plumbing Talks | Contractor Magazine
Forums | Electrical Construction & Maintenance (EC&M) Magazine
Comfortech365 Virtual Event