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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    11

    Tailight Warranty and Ruud UPNE030JAZ Heat Pump

    Hi all,

    I'm a homeowner not an HVAC expert but I'm learning fast. I got "tailight warranteed" by my installer and my UPNE030JAZ heat pump and achiever UGTA09EZ gas (LP) furnace is working furnace-only, no heat pump.

    It was installed 9/08 and worked through about early January then I noticed the heat pump wouldn't come on any more (36'F balance point). So I called the installer who came by when I wasn't around (wife was), claims he pulled out a temp sensor or thermostat of some kind from the condenser (for testing) and I've not been able to reach him since in the last 2 months. I have no idea what's going on in his head nor what the status of my unit is.

    So my issue is this: I opened the service cover on the condenser and took a look at the gear there to see if I actually saw anything missing (eg sensor unplugged, circuit board missing etc) but it doesn't appear there is anything out of place. So my HP looks intact, tech is MIA- I'm thinking I should just get another tech out here, pay the $$$ and get this thing fixed.

    Ideally I'd like to run some basic tests myself to determine if there's an obvious problem I could fix. Also I don't really want to pay a tech to come out just to tell me the previous idiot has a control board or something and he can't help me until I get it back.

    Pix attached to show what it looks like. Does anything look out of place???

    TIA
    Attached Images Attached Images   

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Richmond, Virginia
    Posts
    4,264
    Any tech you call can tell you if something is missing. They have access to all the parts. They won't tell you there's nothing they can do without parts being returned etc.

    You will be told soon that DIY instructions aren't allowed here, read the rules, etc. Just don't be surprised. I'm not a moderator so I won't try to enforce the rules on you.
    There is nothing more frightful than ignorance in action....Mark Twain

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Coming to a town near you soon
    Posts
    762
    the Thermometer may be any where, the duel fuel thermometer can be put on the roof (although not a good place for it), so the pictures are really not telling us anything. Id call someone else out to look at the unit. they can install a new sensor. Where Did you find this guy anyway?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Zelienople, Pa
    Posts
    2,965
    Call the manager of the company and let him know about his technician.
    How tall are you Private???!!!!

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    11
    Thanks for the replies guys.

    The "tech" owns his own business which is the problem. I would have screamed loud and early had it not been the case.

    The thermostat outdoor sensor that works with the balance point is clearly stuck up by the roof soffet. I can see that clearly and traced it out from an earlier problem. My question was related to the tech telling my wife and I that he took "some part" out for bench testing but I can't see anything obviously missing.

    I think I'll take the advice offered here and just get a real technician out here that knows his @ss from a hole in the ground.

    Thanks again.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Richmond, Virginia
    Posts
    4,264
    Maybe he replaced a defective part and wants to bench test the part he removed. Is the system operating properly now?
    There is nothing more frightful than ignorance in action....Mark Twain

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by HVAC Pro View Post
    Maybe he replaced a defective part and wants to bench test the part he removed. Is the system operating properly now?
    No. The backup LP heat via furnace works only in emergency mode.

    If I put it into the normal heat mode when the thermostat is above the balance point (white rodgers thermostat 1F95-1277), the fan comes on and blows cool (room temp) air for about 10 min and eventually gives up and switches to stage 2 LP heat. Rather than deal with that I just threw it into emergency mode to keep stage 2.

    I believe the tech said that they couldn't find anything wrong and could force the heat pump to operate (not sure how) but that when set normally via the home thermostat it failed to come on. Thus the thinking on his part was perhaps there is a part on the heat pump itself that failed to work properly (some other thermostat or [pressure?] switch that shuts it down if temps drop too cold or something).

    When I last spoke with him, he said that he was trying to get a tech to come out from Ruud to inspect the setup as he was out of ideas. That's been a while now...

    Is it likely I can or should call Ruud or just get another tech? Also, I can't seem to find any manuals or diagrams on the ruud gear. Is this hidden or controlled so that homeowners can't get access to it?

    thx

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    11

    Talking Happy Ending...

    Quote Originally Posted by HVAC Pro View Post
    Maybe he replaced a defective part and wants to bench test the part he removed. Is the system operating properly now?
    Happy ending (I think): I took the cover off of the condenser unit again and tested for basic power etc on the 4 wires from the thermostat to the control board on the condenser/heat pump.

    It looked fine and in the midst of pointing my snout around in there i noticed that the control board PCB had printed labels on it and 2 status leds with a small table indicating what they reported.

    So I punched the thermostat back into heat pump mode, called for heat and went back outside and checked the board. Sure enough the status leds told me "low pressure lockout *". The asterisk corresponded to "short test pins to reset" Ah ha....

    Being a computer engineer, I know all about shorting/jumping test pins. So I put a screw driver tip across the pins and, voila- heat pump is working!

    So it's "fixed" but being a total novice, what is likely to have caused the heat pump to throw a low-pressure lockout?

    Can that be caused by running it at too low an outside temp? My balance point is 34'F.

    Thanks guys!

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Kingston Ontario Canada
    Posts
    1,209
    Quote Originally Posted by PDMeat View Post
    Happy ending (I think): I took the cover off of the condenser unit again and tested for basic power etc on the 4 wires from the thermostat to the control board on the condenser/heat pump.

    It looked fine and in the midst of pointing my snout around in there i noticed that the control board PCB had printed labels on it and 2 status leds with a small table indicating what they reported.

    So I punched the thermostat back into heat pump mode, called for heat and went back outside and checked the board. Sure enough the status leds told me "low pressure lockout *". The asterisk corresponded to "short test pins to reset" Ah ha....

    Being a computer engineer, I know all about shorting/jumping test pins. So I put a screw driver tip across the pins and, voila- heat pump is working!

    So it's "fixed" but being a total novice, what is likely to have caused the heat pump to throw a low-pressure lockout?

    Can that be caused by running it at too low an outside temp? My balance point is 34'F.

    Thanks guys!
    My Carrier 38YZA (410 system) was kicking out on low pressure in very cold weather a couple of winters ago. The problem was refrigerant charge was a little low. It's been fine ever since.

    thorton
    _______________________
    Experience is learning what doesn't work.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    66,804
    Unless your outdoor temps dropped below-20.
    You didn't run it when it was too cold out.

    So you still need to call another company to have it checked.
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    How-to-apply-for-Professional

    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Keokuk, IA
    Posts
    5,520
    Just a thought... but personally I'd still get a service tech out there. There could be a chance that the low pressure switch was bypassed by the tech that took the part. So you may have reset the fault, but the safety might have been removed. I'd confirm what specifically the tech had done to the unit and why it was left out of service.

    I could be completely wrong... but something doesn't add up.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Richmond, Virginia
    Posts
    4,264
    Sounds like you need to have it checked (best by someone else). If the balance point is set at 34, it should never see pressures low enough under normal operation to trip the LP switch. I still like the Honeywell 8000 series VisionPro thermostat with outdoor sensor (or IAQ) for dual fuel operation.
    There is nothing more frightful than ignorance in action....Mark Twain

  13. #13
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN, USA
    Posts
    33,398
    Sometimes we can't find a trip reason, sometimes we can. Had an RPNE locked out, turns out the outdoor TXV was bad. Had a dual fuel RPNL locked out the other day, reset and checked the 410 level, right on the button. Would be wise to have a good going-over.

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