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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    25,961

    I'm the Journeyman and you're the Apprentice

    Opinions, please.

    We have recently re-focused on cleanliness in our mechanical rooms. Our apprentice has been busting his a$$ catching up from some years of neglect.

    Now, along comes one of our journeymen, in a hurry, splashes oil all over, throws some cat litter on it and runs off.

    The apprentice gets pi$$ed and says something to the journeyman and gets slapped down with the title of this thread.

    "I'm the Journeyman and you're the Apprentice."

    What is your take on this. I really think that it's a respect issue and that the journeyman is wrong.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Location
    Southern Indiana
    Posts
    73
    I believe that person just needs to be ignored. You are only as good as the people you suround yourself with and this person from what you are saying just wants to bring another employee down to bring himself up (in his mind) or just does not know how to handle the sittuation and instead of talking about it he rather yell and demean people.

    Try not to work with him he will eventually get the picture and either ask you why or move on. Hopefully you both can work it out together because he just may know something you haven't learned yet.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    41
    I have similar experiences. If you think it is wrong for him to do it and feel comfortable enough have a Journeyman to Journeyman talk with him. It doesn't have to be condescending just inform him that it wasn't cool for him to do that to the guys trying to do their jobs right.

    I myself got into the face of a master when I was a 3 year apprentice. He wanted to leave an unsafe condition and I was polite but insistent that it not be left. I won the argument and i think he gained some respect for me in the process.

    MrFixit

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    516
    bottom line is he is the apprentice working with a journeyman, no i am not giving the guy full freedom to be a jerk, but he did put kitty litter on it at least, maybee the guy has alot of calls and important stuff to do, take the time and clean up behind him, gain his respect, learn alot from him and out perform him at his job, stay close to your freinds but even closer to your enemies i always say, just make sure the big boss sees you making the extra effort cleaning up someone else mess, and soon youll make more money thatn the guy that left the mess, just takes time and being patiant, trust me no matter what job you ever work there will always be "that guy" you can deal with him now or later, but dont make a issue out of it it will not end well, on the other hand a "unsafe condition" absolutly i would get in the guys face no matter who it was!
    Jason J Saylor
    Pinellas County Schools
    HVAC Tech/Part Time HVAC Instructor Fortis College
    Pinellas County Florida

    "You will encounter many distractions and many temptations to put your goals aside: The security of a job, a wife who wants kids, Whatever. But if you hang in there, always following your vision, I have no doubt you will succeed.
    Larry Flynt quote

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    25,961
    Quote Originally Posted by RisingTemp View Post
    I believe that person just needs to be ignored. You are only as good as the people you suround yourself with and this person from what you are saying just wants to bring another employee down to bring himself up (in his mind) or just does not know how to handle the sittuation and instead of talking about it he rather yell and demean people.

    Try not to work with him he will eventually get the picture and either ask you why or move on. Hopefully you both can work it out together because he just may know something you haven't learned yet.
    You must work with him...

    This is not the first time he has done this type of thing. If he misses a diagnosis or does something wrong, it's "Oops" but, let somebody else drop the ball and LOOK OUT.

    I believe that I will have a 'man-to-man' with him and let him know that respect for co-workers is important whether they are journeymen or apprentices.

    As far as "being in a hurry" this guys exists in a perpetual state of self-induced hurry. Always too busy to pick up after himself and is a big part of the reason that the apprentice has been working so hard to get the compressor rooms back in shape.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    State of Confusion
    Posts
    1,210
    Quote Originally Posted by jpsmith1cm View Post
    "I'm the Journeyman and you're the Apprentice."
    Its B.S. How about we all work together?
    No one should be degraded.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    chicago suburbs
    Posts
    4,422
    kick the primadonna in the nuts.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Location:Raleigh NC
    Posts
    9,668
    "I'm the Journeyman and you're the Apprentice."
    I Say
    1. then you should know better
    2. You should set an example
    3. Rank has it privileges BUT MOST OF ALL IT HAS IT'S RESPONSIBILITIES

    And I'll think to myself he's the Apprentice and your the A$$hole Journeyman. Hey he is important he holds two titles and in the order given.
    If you help others then you are a Success

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Posts
    6,966
    give him help for the equipment only let him slob up the work area,then beep the apprentice off the job to leave him alone....a couple of times and this guy will ***** up a storm back to the office.
    "when in doubt...jump it out" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U1qEZHhJubY

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    12,077
    good topic.

    i have always hated the whole, " i am me and I have status or rank or what ever"

    I treat our apprentices as professionals and I always remind myself to take on a demeanor of mentor when they are around. Cleaning up, doing the $hit jobs, whatever. I don't delegate it to them based on their "apprentice status" . If I am the one standing around, I will pick up the broom myself. With the exception of one or two of our journeymen, we all have the same mindset with our apprentices. We actually fight over them sometimes to which one we want when we need another guy.

    Apprentices in our shop are all A friggen plus young kids and their dedication is bar none impressive to me. I am happy with every one of them. Good solid young guys. I am serious. It amazes me sometimes how lucky the owners of our shop are to not just have one but four of these young guys.

    Our young guys go to school, work their buts off and sometimes are willing to work free to gain experience. Good natured, hard workers, honest, practical, not lazy, dedicated, aspiring.

    All of these qualities I have hopefully had a part in influencing them to be.

    We have a guy right now about ready to turn out. Just an awesome guy. I mean, if I had the jump this kid did on experience, exposure to the trade, the mentorship he has gotten from everyone. I mean damn I could have been much better than I am. He will suprass all of us inside the next 5 years. Really has his $hit together. And he's got two more on his tail. Talking about our young guys excites me. If I only had the jump these guys do. I am happy for them.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    25,961
    As of now, I have QUIETLY expressed my disagreement with him on this matter.

    We spoke on the phone earlier today and I told him that I believed that it was disrespectful of the work that our apprentice has been doing to act the way that he did.

    I said that it would only have taken a few second to sweep up the mess and be done with it.

    I have been working with this guy for about 8 years now. It is only a matter of time before he does something like it again. At that time, I just might get a little disrespectful towards him.

    There is only ONE way to lead, and that is by example. By setting the bar high and making that example one worth following we can breed a better next generation of technicians. That should be EVERY technician's goal.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    St. Louis
    Posts
    108
    I would give anything to be someone's apprentice. To be honest I would have said "screw it...he's already put in his dues" and I would have swept up the mess. But that's just because I have a tough skin and I'm a hard worker. Plus I'm pretty desperate for a good position where I could learn from a pro. But at the same time that "pro" should have led a good example and shown the rookie how to be professional and clean. I think you should leave a job and the place should be looking better than when you got there. But maybe I'm still an opinistic newbie. Someday I'll get my break.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    1,461
    Having been there done that. i worked for the Gov for a little over 10 years. When I got started I was a helper, even with a strong mechanical background and a degree in electronics and a minor in industrial design. My main jib was to make the equipment rooms shine, we even had manufacturers take photos of their equipment in "my" equipment rooms. Still we would have repairs that would have to be made. The journeyman would come in and "fix" teh problem leaving a mess for me to clean. I hated it, I would say things like " I dont care about making money, I just love to mop floors." Me having all of the tools and more meant nothing. Having all of the ability to make the same repairs that the journeyman made meant nothing. I was a helper, and it sucked. 10 flights of steps to the mech room and oops I forgot my meter, I had to go back down and get his meter. It sucked for sure, but it was what it was and I did it. I paid my dues and I have no respect for "helpers" who think that they are beyond that. We are in a new time where suddenly "helpers" think we owe them something, even though I would NEVER put them through what I went through. Being a slob and not cleaning up after ones self is a problem but "helpers" job is to help and that may mean cleaning up after the one who has already been there done that. It is a fine line but it has to be drawn at some point. Helpers nowadays are getting breaks that I had never even wished for in the past. PAY YOUR DUES AND RESPECT YOUR VETS, IF YOU DO NOT YOU WILL NOT BE WORTH A SHAT IN THIS OR ANY FIELD.
    "It's always controls"

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