United Association?

[limbach123]

local 602 washington dc

[harley2003rkc]

Schedule "A".... Your funny! We've been trying for years to get the contractors into oversight committee meetings so we can work on a schedule "A". And yes, Don House is the rep who finally offered to meet with me. But only after I offered to put up a web site posting all of my correspondence with him. And to start posting about my experiences on every trades website I could find. I'm starting here because I've lurked here for years. He seemed to immediately realize it wasn't an empty threat.

Locally were pissed. And now he's accusing one of my BA's of putting me up to this. What he fails to realize is that I regularly write my representatives. These guys are always telling us to write our reps and appearently they didn't realize they're our reps too. I've also managed to locate his address and plan on sending him a brick. My intentions are to write him a scathing letter detailing his lack of knowledge in contracts and offering him a brick to start building the foundations of a proper contract. Unfortunately I found out today that they're moving the UA to a new building somewhere in Maryland. So I'm forced to hold off on the letter campaign. But if anyone else is actually interested in doing something to better the UA, I'd be happy to post the new address when I get it.

As for Don House and the UA not caring about service fitters, well they're going to have to wake up or lose us! Locally can I get the same pay, better insurance, vacation time, and less aggrevation if I were to work non union. I've always said I'd never work non union, so my only alternative at this time is fight these ignorant (insert insult here)! I pray things get better in the long run, because I'm not going to finish my career working under these conditions.

[21degrees]

Don't kid yourselves, The UA is only a hiring hall and the back bone is almost broke. They hire 50 year old apprentices that could not make it in the real world to line there pockets and keep the membership up. They have givin me job security or never protected me. I now own my own company and see the other side of the coin. You can't blame some of these companies for being double breasted. They are trying to survive just like the UA. Good Luck with your crusade and I am not anti union, they still do have some of the best tradesmen/women arround, just need to police their members better and get rid of the Dead beats and companies would sure change their attitudes.

[Some Dude]

Harley why would you deal with unreasonablenes by being unreasonable? Either he will respond negativly or he wont at all. These guys either care or they are doing their 4 years and out , hopefully with a much fatter pension. They never get impeached no matter what they do and truth be told who knows what they have to listen to on a daily basis. Like one of my Business Managers told me ' when the phone rings its nevcer someone telling me things are going great or im doing a good job'.
Take the high road and ask him to luch and try and talk to him. If it doesnt work out then you lost an hour.If it does you gained a friend and hopefully some insight. Belive it or not they are human and we spend a heck of alot more time pissed off at them than they do us.
Just my two cents , hate to see someone unnecessarily upset.

[mike grabowski]

Depending on the situation i will not charge the customers or the boss overtime. If its a customer i have had for a long time usually i do not charge them overtime. But they do not call me in at night or weekends for the most part.

My thinking as far as being a service mechanic is this:
The customers keep us working. If they treat me goodi will treat them good. If i piss off to many customers they will not call me or us back, when this happens i will not be working much since i will have no customers.

Local 50 here.

[CincyHVAC]

My answer is that if you are working for a contractor that is safety conscious, you should not have any issues with the national wording of the UA contract. We take any safety issues up in-house. The safety director will meet the tech out on the job and review the safety issues. If after that meeting it is determined that the work area is unsafe, the safety director will address any issues with the customer. The tech is not forced to work in any area deemed unsafe by the Safety Director.

Just my 2 cents.

[Heavyevans]

Depending on the situation i will not charge the customers or the boss overtime.

Please don't take this the wrong way. It just bugs me when I hear it.

You don't charge your boss anything. He pays you for the work you do.

[harley2003rkc]

Ok guys just to clarify. This isn't about non union vs. union. Its about the fact that working conditions have become worse since the NM&SA was dumped on us. Its about the fact that even non union guys wouldn't put up with what their trying to do to us locally. Our local contractors have realized that we're locked into a contract and they fully intend to abuse it. The non union guys I know here in town would have walked off the job by now. So this isn't just a crusade. I don't think its unreasonable to expect the same treatent that the non union guys are entitled to, especially considering most of our complaints are just common decency. Were not looking for money, we'd be happy if they'd just quit trying to abuse us! As for our incompetent HVAC&R director, I will make it my lifes goal to either see UA rid of him or the local conditions changed. I really don't care which. So he can work with us or put up with us, its his choice.

[HVACJOEK]

N.Y.C 638 ... The national contract it has always been a thorn in my rib, my understanding of it always challenges the employers interpretation... for instance it is not business as usual during a strike, work that should be done is only emergency critical service... no maintenance or construction, and rule out the mom and pop deli's too..... I am glad I am working under the "Home local contract".

Remember you catch more flies with honey then with vinegar.

[softtail]

IMHO, the UA at a national level leaves the national contracts ''loose'' and up to interpretation on purpose to allow each contractor or contractor group the "flexibilty" to make up their own conditions and rules. They, the UA, would never attempt something like this on a construction related contract due to the fact the rank and file fitters/welders would start a war with them. The UA knows the service guys are easy and divided, and only a very few are vocal with issues which are not right.

Keep in mind, there is not one paid officer at the national level with a service background, they don't know or care to know about service, other than, service dues monies supplements the UA's construction building trades interests big time.

The minimum would be to at least require the UA HVAC service director to have a real service background. Do you think that might be a good start? Would they appoint a service guy to be the director of, let's say, pipeline construction?

Any attempt to boot Donny House would be a step in the right direction. It only takes a short conversation with Donny to realize Donny is a complete hand job, and the only reason he's there is to sell out the service mechanic.

Sounds like Harley2 would be a good replacement for Donny H., I'd do whatever I could.

[frick]

left the ##@$%#$^%$&%*#$&#%@#union and my benefits got better!!!

[mikesands]

I haven't seen these types of problems , our local is pretty staright forward. We have very good leadership and representation at the hall.

[harley2003rkc]

mikesands count yourseld lucky that you haven't been affected yet. I have a lot of respect for my local representatives to, but when the national contract took over everything we got fooked hard. Do whatever it takes to make sure you don't have to work under the NM&SA.

frick the point you just made is becoming reality real fast here. But I owe the local my entire career so I can't walk away without a fight and still have a clear conscious.

softtail if you've got any ideas on how to get rid of Don House I'd be all ears. I've already emailed the Bill Hite asking him how to get him unappointed, but I haven't heard back.

If anybody here has some free time I'm begging you to please email Bill Hite, Don House, and the rest of the "Good Ole Boys". I will continue to regularly be as big a pain in their collective azz as I can until something changes. Its time for the service side to stand up, and stand together. These are our days, when the economy drops, and construction slows, they still have to keep things repaired and maintained. I work in a local with almost 800 service members and were fed up. So I know there are more of us out that are seeing at least some of the same issues. If not I'm sure it won't be long before someone in Washington will come along and make sure you feel the knife in your back too.

[softtail]

I was going to suggest mailing Bill Hite, but your already on that.

Another thought would be to copy your recent correspondences to Hite and House to the UA VPs, all of them, in email and hard copies in the mail. I think you're going to find at least one UA VP which will take a special interest in what your situation is.

Heard Hite already doesn't see eye to eye with House, and keep in mind, House was appointed by someone else.

If we can prove House isn't doing his job and/or dirty at a national level, it will make it easier for Hite to make a change.

[harley2003rkc]

softtail now we're on the right track. I like your idea about emailing the VP's. I'll look into putting a nice email together tomorrow when I can put a little more focus into it. But I'm going to see if I can't locate some email addresses tonite. Now we just need to figure how to get service guys to unite. As I said before this isn't a money issue, its about working conditions and keeping the existing working conditions rather then letting Don House throw them away.

[softtail]

Harley2,

You may want to consider emailing and/or mailing hard copies to the UA VPs at their home local offices. The UA VP position isn't a full time UA position, the VP still typically works as a paid officer for his home local, usually as BM.

If we could get something solid on Donny, we could file charges against him with the UA executive board at the national level. That might get some attention from the "good ole boys".

To unite all of the service fitters is tough due to all of the ball suckers, bobble-heads, and company sucks, but there's still a whole bunch of good people to include.

[harley2003rkc]

Don House wrote a contract that had no provisions to ensue that working conditions didn't get worse. There was no effort made to keep each individual local working under there original conditions. That in of itself should be a punishable offense. Benjamin Franklin once stated "He who sacrifices freedom for security deserves neither", and when Don sacrificed our working conditions he is essentially traded them for temporary working security. I believe he deserves neither the freedom to work in tolerable conditions nor the security that he has a job. He is a traitor to every working man in this country.

In my humble opinion he has also committed a crime against integrity. I was taught that integrity was one of the fondations of the UA and if he had any integrity he'd be an open book. He violated that integrity when he refused to answer my questions. I have tried numerous times to talk to him about his lack of knowledge in the individual labor markets his beloved NM&SA covers. He has refused to answer even the most miniscule questions concerning his understanding of my labor market in particular. I would ask about his knowledge of other labor markets, but I'm not going to stand here and pretend to understand an area of this country I've never worked in.

[softtail]

Donny House has no idea about the service trade, service work, or service mechanics because his experience in the field was just working as a basic tubing fitter. He can't even calibrate a receiver controller after running the tubing to them for years. He hasn't worked as a service fitter and probably couldn't start up a service van.

Think about this. Why would he care about the conditions and contracts concerning service fitters, when if he ever had to work with the tools again, he would never work service because he has no experience or desire to run service. He'd probably end up on the tubing gang in a double breasted control shop again because he can't do anything else.

How can he say service guys need to furnish hand tools when the BTC guys are require to furnish no tools at all? Some service guys have 10-15K worth of their own tools on their trucks. Try that with a BTC fitter/welder.

How about the Schedule "A" option in the national agreement, no other UA agreement has such an inclusion. If the UA tried some schedule "A" BS in a national construction agreement, the BTC guys would linch every one involved and then some. The UA and Donny can only get away with this schedule "A" stuff with the service guys.

At least Donny stays consistent in the fact he chooses to maintain no integrity and treats service mechanics as second rate members.

[harley2003rkc]

Yeah I hear ya about the tool issue. And it seems to me that it should be another punishable offense to right a contract in direct violation of the UA Constitution. Page 112, SEC. 192. clearly states "No member of the United Association shall be permitted to furnish tools." I guess were either not members and should stop paying dues or their sending a message that the protections provided by the UA don't apply to service members.

[Chuck65]

Do we have any other United Association members online here? Please check in if so guys. I've got some questions for ya.

Here