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  1. #1
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    Apr 2007
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    Southwest Missouri
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    162

    Certification as Damage Control?

    I started a telemarketing job on October 15th, which was about two-and-a-half months after I was fired from my first HVAC job; no reason was given. It took me about five months to get that job after graduating from trade school with straight A's. The HVAC job ads for my area were and are almost entirely for technicians with years of experience. Now that I've gone from someone with no experience to someone who was terminated after an extremely short time in the field,* I'm untouchable everywhere I go for HVAC work. I pose the following question: if you as an owner or recruiter read a resume with the education and employment history I just described, how would you feel if it also said that applicant later went on to get a NATE certification and had completed several courses through RSES?

    * Most of the five months I worked for that HVAC company were spent in the office as a dispatcher. The owner got better value out of me there due to my data entry skills.

  2. #2
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    Apr 2007
    Location
    lake grove, ny
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    59
    that sucks i got fired due to a personal problem with my old boss but cant get a new job because of him b.s.ing in supply houses.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Southwest Missouri
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    162
    So what did you do?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    St.louis metro area
    Posts
    315
    Quote Originally Posted by HVAC Student View Post
    I started a telemarketing job on October 15th, which was about two-and-a-half months after I was fired from my first HVAC job; no reason was given. It took me about five months to get that job after graduating from trade school with straight A's. The HVAC job ads for my area were and are almost entirely for technicians with years of experience. Now that I've gone from someone with no experience to someone who was terminated after an extremely short time in the field,* I'm untouchable everywhere I go for HVAC work. I pose the following question: if you as an owner or recruiter read a resume with the education and employment history I just described, how would you feel if it also said that applicant later went on to get a NATE certification and had completed several courses through RSES?

    * Most of the five months I worked for that HVAC company were spent in the office as a dispatcher. The owner got better value out of me there due to my data entry skills.

    Was the ad for which you got hired for one of the "technicians with years of experience"? If so, how did you land the job. Sounds like he couldn't find the experienced tech he was looking for, so he opted for you. Bad move on his part. If he doesn't have the time or desire to teach a new guy a few tricks, then he shouldn't have hired you and expected you to be a super tech. It didn't sound as though you were giving much of a chance since most of your time was spent in the office.

    How did you get along with him? If you got along good, he might still give you a good reference. AS far as the "untouchable" is concerned, if it makes you feel any better, I would say that 2 out of every 3 people who completes these trade school classes never land a job in this field. So you are not alone.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Southwest Missouri
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    162
    Originally posted by Joe Cool
    Was the ad for which you got hired for one of the "technicians with years of experience"?
    No; I heard about them through my trade school.

    Originally posted by Joe Cool
    How did you get along with him? If you got along good, he might still give you good reference.
    We seemed to get along okay, but while I was there he abruptly and angrily fired one of the techs who I think had been there for about two years. The tech had a no-call, no-show following a very rough overtime-laden weekend. The owner subsequently happened to be in a vehicle with me and said good things about that technician's overall performance. He ultimately opined that people can't do well all of the time but never seemed to regret his decision to fire the technician. (Was it cognitive dissonance?) He didn't break the news of my own termination himself, so I don't know how he feels about me now. However, I've heard the Office/HR/Safety Manager take a call before and simply say a former employee worked between such-a-date and such-a-date. I casually asked him about it and he said it's company policy to give that exact response. This person was my immediate superior while I was a dispatcher and routinely worked a few feet away from him all day. He was also the person who actually told me I was fired. If someone calls the office to ask about me, he will almost certainly be the one to take the call and he will simply give the span of time for which I worked at the company.

    Originally posted by Joe Cool
    AS far as the "untouchable" is concerned, if it makes you feel any better, I would say that 2 out of every 3 people who completes these trade school classes never land a job in this field. So you are not alone.
    How many people who had straight A's in trade school have this happen? I was well aware of the stigma of recent trade school graduates early on in my schooling and resolved to do whatever it took (including using No-Doz as a crutch for all-nighters) to make myself stand out. It made little difference in actual interviews, though ironically it seemed to pique the interest of my former employer, who complained about how difficult it is to find good people.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    49
    Just curious.

    Why do you have to put that job on your resume? Why not just leave it off? A gap is better than a negative work history.

    Go to another town.

    BTW, what does having "straight A's" in trade school have to do with anything? Do you really think anyone gives a damn? You sound like you think you're entitled.

  7. #7
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    Apr 2007
    Location
    Southwest Missouri
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    162
    Originally posted by ideafx
    Why do you have to put that job on your resume? Why not just leave it off? A gap is better than a negative work history.
    If I did that it would look like I didn't work in the trade at all for over one year after I finished school, which would seem highly suspicious to an interviewer.

    Originally posted by ideafx
    BTW, what does having "straight A's" in trade school have to do with anything? Do you really think anyone gives a damn?
    I'm not trying to say book learning is the same as experience. However, I do think good grades in trade school should demonstrate three things to an interviewer:

    1) I get more out of training than the average applicant at my experience level.

    2) I have a stronger grasp of the basics. My school graduates people who can't check volts.

    3) I have more intrinsic motivation to improve my skills and eventually become a full-blown technician.

    Originally posted by ideafx
    You sound like you think you're entitled.
    I don't think I'm entitled, but I do think the objective facts I just mentioned demonstrate I'm a better hire than the average recent trade school graduate.

  8. #8
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    Apr 2007
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    St.louis metro area
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    315
    Quote Originally Posted by HVAC Student View Post
    If I did that it would look like I didn't work in the trade at all for over one year after I finished school, which would seem highly suspicious to an interviewer.

    I don't think I'm entitled, but I do think the objective facts I just mentioned demonstrate I'm a better hire than the average recent trade school graduate.

    I don't think that it would look suspicious to employers at all. I know people that have graduated and were not able to get a job in the HVAC field at all. I know, I'm one of them. The certificate that I received may as well came out of a Cracker Jack box. The job placement for trade school graduates is not nearly as good as those trades schools try to make you believe.

    You may be a better hire than the "average recent trade school graduate", but you are missing the point. In this horrible economy, there are enough people out of work that no employer has to worry about hiring anybody straight out of school.

  9. #9
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    Apr 2007
    Location
    Southwest Missouri
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    Originally posted by Joe Cool
    You may be a better hire than the "average recent trade school graduate", but you are missing the point. In this horrible economy, there are enough people out of work that no employer has to worry about hiring anybody straight out of school.
    Okay, I may have misunderstood ideafx. So much for the technician shortage. :-/

  10. #10
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    Sep 2002
    Posts
    4,970
    The thing I get a kick out of is that they don't force those HVAC schools to tell the applicants that if you live in the town the schools are , you most likely need to move somewhere else to get a job.

    The towns there in are loaded with kids that have taken those classes and if you get a job the pay will probably suck being they have so many kids to hire and fire.

    We use to tease the potential students when they would stop in asking information for class homework finding out what wages were and differant things about the trade.

    We would ask them how they like living here . A lot would say I have lived here for years and would never think of moving. Then we would ask if they were the top student in the class being if your not your chance of not having to move somewhere else to get a job isn't very good. They stood there with a shocked look on there face wondering why they were never told that before they payed their tuition

  11. #11
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    Apr 2007
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    Southwest Missouri
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    So as not to stray too far off topic, let me repeat my thread's question to you: how would you as an interviewer react to someone with the employment and trade school history I described but who had NATE certification and several RSES courses completed after the fact?

    By the way dec, please contact me on AIM so I can pick your brain.

  12. #12
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    Apr 2007
    Location
    St.louis metro area
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    315
    In my opinion, I think that schools need to be regulated. There should only be a certian number of students allowed in any giving course of study based on the expected job vacancies in that field. Only then would your schooling actually mean something to an employer. Until this happens, only 10% of the people will receive any benefit from their schooling and the rest will be in debt, trying to pay for their tuition, without the job that they went to school to get.

  13. #13
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    Apr 2007
    Location
    Southwest Missouri
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    Originally posted by Joe Cool
    In my opinion, I think that schools need to be regulated.
    I have an opinion of my own about that, but please address the question I posed for this thread. How would you as an interviewer feel if you read a resume with the education and employment history I described but which had a NATE certification and several RSES courses after that?

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