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  1. #27
    TMRCIN, I see your message!

    These are all really good thoughts, I am going to pass them on to the dealer. It was the owner himself who installed my system, and he is coming out monday morning with a trane rep.

    I'm thinking of printing out this entire thread and showing it to him. You all have a lot of good suggestions, and I greatly appreciate them.

    By the way, yesterday my son had a few friends over, and it was a warm, humid day, and we were actually getting too hot. About 4:00pm I set the air conditioner to come on to cool at 72 degrees. I kept it to air condition all night till about 12:00 noon today. It wasn't stale at all, seemed fresh enough, and only a little drier than I'm used to, which makes sense, it's a new system and SHOULD, as you all have said, remove moisture. I definitely felt better than the heater mode.
    About an hour ago, since the air doesn't come on that much, and it seemed to be too humid and a little chilly again, I turned the heat on. I can alrady tell its stale and dry. In other words, there's a lot of fluctuation in comfort, is this normal?

  2. #28
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Lancaster Pennsylvania
    Posts
    60
    I have installed about 50-60 TCE in homes in the last two years. I have had one problem with a customer complaining of a dry feeling, and an irritating odor after the CleanEffects was installed. We did turn down the ozone power from 5-3 Ppb. We also identified that there was an interaction between the CleanEffects and Silcone caulk that we used to seal the ductwork. Which we believe was causing the smell and iritation. Everything subsided after a few days of operation... And we don't use silicone caulk around CleanEffects anymore. (This is mentioned in the install manual).

    The other point I have is about UV lights. There is no information about location of UV lights with CleanEffects in the install manuals. But I do know from experience that UV lights can desinigrate humidifier panels and Media Filters if exposed to direct uv light (in line of sight from UV bulb.)

    Hope This helps
    Jordan

  3. #29
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    44
    You must be very sensitive to changes in your environment. I suggest you look into adding some outside air to the system. Most all houses are short on ventilation air.If you are in the habit of keeping windows closed all year around and heating -- cooling as needed then a little ventilation is worth the added load. This can be done as simple as running a 6" pipe to the outside and cutting it into the return duct. Any time the fan runs it will be pulling in outside air. In my house I have added an economizer and can pull in up to 100% outside air if outdoor conditions are right.

  4. #30
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    416

    Could the Heater Strips Be Drying out the House??

    OK, so the dry/stale problem is in heating mode.

    Does the Emer. Heat (orange) come on on the t-stat when your heat is running??

    Could the electric strip heaters be drying out the air if they were always coming on due to mis-wiring??? No expert, but if electric strips were always on wouldn't this create a very dry air/environment???

    When heat is on and air is blowing, does it air at register feel luke warm or nice and toasty???

    If you have indoor thermometer, place on supply register and tell us the temp its reads and your outdoor temperature.....

    Look at your outdoor power meter, when heat is on is the disc (think small record player) spinning very fast....

    Any info here helps....

  5. #31
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    44
    As usual the Maytag Man is correct about upsizing the unit being part of the problem. The original duct was sized for 1400CFM and now you are trying to get 2000 CFM thru it. If the air cleaner was sized for 5Ton this may be a problem.

  6. #32
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Suppy NC
    Posts
    4,513
    i did try to read this entire tread before responding but more then likely missed a few things

    Did they replace the ductwork when they replace the system or use the old ducts?

    I bleieve fl has a lot or is mostly fiberduct and this i find has the tendendisy to grow mold. With any disturbance of this duct you can send thing airborn and will in some cases cause irratation. The ordor you smell can also be from the old ducts.

    You also should have the unit checked to make sure it is draining properly so water isnt sitting and causeing ordors also.

    the filter IMHO since it is apparent causeing a problem for you and your family should be removed and a media merve 10 or higher installed

  7. #33
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    MN
    Posts
    2,677
    it is possible this clean effects cannot be removed from the unit( may be integrated in Air handler,whats the model #)

    this is not a 2 speed blower, it is variable speed(or better be) Get it cranked down to low output setting, and test the humidity levels in the home, if they are low(which I suspect) get a humidifier installed also.

    The lights can be used, just need to be mounted somewhere that is not in line of sight of the clean effects (as stated by another poster)
    You can't fix stupid

  8. #34
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Coming to a town near you soon
    Posts
    774
    Personally I wouldnít give you a refund. If you buy a car with synthetic carpet and come to find out your allergic to it do you think the dealerships going to give you a refund? I donít think so. Iím not trying to be a jerk but your allergies are an existing condition. The HVAC Company put in a filter that is doing what it is designed for. I would think a discount on a media filter would be fair. But the service company had to pay for the filter and someone to put it in, so why should they just give you something for free because you have a rare condition.

  9. #35
    I agree with Clint, Iím allergic to peanuts so should I ask for a refund after I eat a baby Ruth bar.
    Iím sure the dealer will take the filter out. But I think his point is that he canít sell it since itís basically used now.
    Try a different filter and ask about a steam humidifier.

  10. #36
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Suppy NC
    Posts
    4,513
    wow

    as contractors we have a responsibility to our customers. I we sell them something and it turns out they are elergic or sensative to it them we should be will to step up and make things right. JMHO

    to just tell this person your beat and it isnt my fault you are elergic isnt in the best interest of the contractor or customer.

    install a merv filter and refund the cost differance. Isnt enough of a differance to loose a customer over. Again JMHO

  11. #37
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Houston Texas
    Posts
    6,327
    Just from what the homeowner has said the contractor hard sold the Clean Effect; it was not something she wanted. It is also apparent that the contractor did not perform due diligence in his initial design. If he had he would have known that additional work would need to be done for the filter to fit.

    If my company had done this the additional cost required to accommodate the filter would have been borne by us not the homeowner. It is incumbent on the contractor to be cognizant of all necessary requirements to install the equipment they recommend.

    Assuming that all that the OP says is true the contractor should refund the $400.00 and the difference in cost between a media filter and the Clean Effects. I am fairly certain that the Clean Effects can have the cells and the power components removed and it becomes a media filter cabinet. Insert the appropriate filter and they are good to go.

  12. #38
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Rochester NY
    Posts
    4,752
    Didn't get an answer to the tonnage question - but didn't see this question asked;

    Were the ducts cleaned?

    Stronger 5t fan might be cleaning old mold out of your ductwork. Maybe an IAQ test should be performed to determine exactly what IS in the air.

  13. #39
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    128
    Quote Originally Posted by #1 Maytag Man View Post
    I agree with m kilgore, if he doesnít have a hygrometer, than he wonít have the proper tools to take any other measurements, static pressure or IAQ. If you went up 1.5 tons and only had 2 runs added, then you will never see the efficiency you purchased! Your old duct system was DESIGNED for a 3.5 NOT a 5 ton. A basic rule of thumb is 400cfm for every ton, so a 3.5 ton duct system is designed for 1400 cubic feet per minute. Your 16 seer system got its seer rating with a properly matched duct systems. So your 5 ton needs 2000cfm NOT 1400cfm. The two runs he added will be minimal improvements. I (as a buyer in your shoes) would have your duct system changed to see the efficiency you paid for. Especially since you went from geo to an air-to-air heat pump. As far as your health issue, there should be no reason why he couldnít add your uvc to the new system. And if there is no way to put the old one back on, then have a different model install that will work. Between that and a good quality 4inch filter it should take care of you Filtration needs. Ask your dealer if you can swap the filter you have for the above IAQ. I personally would not just install a humidifier without fixing everything else first. Then if it is indeed need, then install a True steam or some other model of humidifier. When you said you purchased a 2 speed, I assume a 2 stage system. If it is a 2 Stage system it will remove much more moisture than your existing system in the cooling mode. Maybe that is what your dealer was referring to when you discussed humidity control. Just stay in contact with your dealer and try to keep the relationship between the 2 of you respectful, Remember - He didnít know you had a medical condition that would clash with the filtration. So give him time to correct everything that needs to be taken care of.

    P.S. As far as your "Once and a life time" investment, keep in mind, they donít make them like they used to. Your average life expectancy is between 7 to 12 years on any new equipment.

    Just a thought for the trane dealers on here - I know that 2 stage Maytag products have Variable speed blower which controlled by a Honeywell IAQ will give you control of dehumidifying. And if you decided to add a humidifier than it can control that as well. Donít know if itís the same on the trane
    hate to steal a thread, but Can you explain how the Honeywell IAQ can control a Maytag VS AH for dehumidifying?

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