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  1. #27
    Join Date
    May 2002
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    9,564
    I'm surprised the bacnet industry leaders aren't making more public statements looking for the multi-vendor software package for configuration. Perhaps you can ask some of them at the next ASHRAE meeting that talks about controls. Maybe they can give you some information.

  2. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by sysint View Post
    I'm surprised the bacnet industry leaders aren't making more public statements looking for the multi-vendor software package for configuration. Perhaps you can ask some of them at the next ASHRAE meeting that talks about controls. Maybe they can give you some information.
    Will do..Sysint...Will do.

  3. #29
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Posts
    9,564
    Freddy, that would be swell.

  4. #30
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Milwaukee, WI
    Posts
    258
    There are several Software packag3es out there that can be used to probe, test BACNET networks. They can be used to read write objects and troubleshoot devices. There is a freeware OPC server and Webserver from SCADAENGINE.COM that can be used to integrate multiple vendors.

    Some of the software used for testing and commissioning is:
    Polarsoft
    Chipkin
    Cimetrics
    Wireshark (BACNET/IP)

    Get your self a good fast RS485 card and you can connect to any network and interface with any manufacture.
    Jeff F.
    www.vfdhelp.com
    VFD, HVAC Motors and Manufacture Assistance.

  5. #31
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Posts
    9,564
    Jeff, I think Freddy is specifically looking for multi-vendor configuration software, not simply a commissioning software. (Like LNS is for Lonworks protocol)

    However, thanks for that information.

  6. #32
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    NY
    Posts
    2,164
    I'm pretty sure that all that software only lets you see network info such as packets, whois, IP addresses etc. I haven't seen any 'device' specific info when runnning any of that software.

  7. #33
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Posts
    9,564
    Not exactly. You can get device informational data, read/writes/COV etc... What you don't get that I know of is the ability to configure those devices with those manufacturer's products. It's not like LON in that respect.

    However, looking at a device like the Loytec LVIS, it scans the controllers on the network and you can configure the Loytec device with the free configuration software. So, that's a start at least.

  8. #34
    That would be correct sysint. I need the multi vendor configuration software to configure all my native Bacnet MSTP sites, including JCI FEC, Andover, Delta, Allerton, Trend, and Reliable.

    I am sure all we are waiting on is some more BTL testing to get all of BACnet's benefits.

  9. #35
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    195
    Quote Originally Posted by sysint View Post
    Not exactly. You can get device informational data, read/writes/COV etc... What you don't get that I know of is the ability to configure those devices with those manufacturer's products. It's not like LON in that respect.

    However, looking at a device like the Loytec LVIS, it scans the controllers on the network and you can configure the Loytec device with the free configuration software. So, that's a start at least.
    So basically, you want the programming software for free? Is that your beef against BACnet?

  10. #36
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Posts
    9,564
    I don't "have a beef" against bacnet.

  11. #37
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    What? Who? Where?
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    I just looked at a site that has T.A.C. Vista (lon), T.A.C. Invensys I/A (lon) and Trane (lon). Is there a software I can use like LNS or Lonwatcher that will enable me to change and/or add programming to each vendors programmable controllers? Speaking to the onsite technician each system had it's own set of software for programmables.

    I was quite surprised that even the two T.A.C. lon systems required individual software to program their "freely" programmable main controllers. He said that the T.A.C. salesman informed him that their next generation of software would have this capability but it would require separate licenses.

    I thought I could just show up and start making changes and configuring all the systems, but that doesn't seem the case. It looks like the ASC will be available to configure, but I don't know what I'm going to do with the programmables.

    Help me, Obi-Lon Kenobi, you're my only hope..................

    kontrol out
    Last edited by kontrolphreak; 10-29-2008 at 11:43 PM.
    "Open is as open does." - Forrest Gump
    "Can't we all just get a Lon?" - Garry Jack
    "BACnet: integration or interrogation?" - The Janitor
    "Open protocols? You can't handle open protocols!" - Nathan R. Jessup
    “What’s that? Aaa… open protocols? Don’t talk about…. open protocols? Are you kidding me? Open protocols? I just hope we can hardwire an interface!” - Jim Mora http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U7fjDS0jKiE

  12. #38
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Posts
    9,564
    Great point. There are only a couple vendors that allow you to have their programming language in a plugin, Distech and Circon (to my knowledge). Circon charges some money but it's available to work in the LNS software you want to use. Distech's is free.

    So, I guess you have some options. If you need freely programables working with your network config tool, it's available to you-- which is more than you get with bacnet at this time.

    CEA709
    Are freely programmables available with open config tools.---Answer YES
    Are ASC controllers available with open config tools.--------Answer YES
    Is there a multi-vendor software configuration tool.---------Answer YES
    Is the field bus modern and robust?------------------------Answer YES
    Highly Scaleable?----------------------------------------Answer YES

    Do you need "plugfests" for interoperability?----------------Answer NO
    Do you need to worry about network addressing/structure?-Answer NO
    Do you need to worry about multi-vendor communication?--Answer NO

    Personally, I like the structured SNVT's. They are highly identifiable, and very standard. No need to look into an object to figure out what it may be. It's there, it's available and it works. Further, when I want to use SNVT_switch I've got one variable for display. If I'm using nci_Setpoint I've got 6 in one variable. Makes for economy in dealing with those variables in display. With bacnet you need two objects to convey SNVT_switch and six for nci_Setpoint.

    Additionally, I like the fact that in a spec you can drill down to the variable names and types to make a very seamless multi-vendor network. For instance, I can have different AHU programmables getting information from a multi-vendor VAV installation and get the same data and types.... without much work and configure all of it with a single piece of software. That capability is impressive.

    I also like that the application of a device is up to the designer, but the communication/data transfer is controlled and rock solid.

    bacnet-- has a nice way of AST functionality, particularly on the Supervisory level. Network fieldbus technology is archaic and poor by comparison. However, Tridium has a nice way of AST functionality too..

    I wonder how many guys buy their upcoming proprietary chipset and don't complain about it? Not to forget mention of Zigbee and Zwave chips...

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