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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    29

    Question: Three Stage Vs Modulating

    So with similar sized systems and pricing for a 2500 Sq Ft house in Michigan I have to which contractor to go with based upon my gut feeling aftger interviewing the salemen regarding their company and feedback from this forum.

    1) Is there a significant comfort advantage between a 3 Stage Bryant/Carrier Infinity (355CAV... and a Modulating York furnace (PC9-UP...) Both 4 ton AH and 100K input.

    2) Bryant offers a 20 Year parts and Labor warranty on the HX whereas York offers lifetime parts (no labor). Are either of these warranties significant (failure rates of current equipment) and would most contractors servicing a Bryant with a failed HX fix it or try selling a new unit with a 30% (or so) credit which is probably the actual York strategy...

    3) By buddy's 10 year old Bryant recently had the secondary HX fall apart. Have the new units changed the secondary HX design or materials? Does York have any real HX issues in their 90%+ line (I don't see class actions on York, but I do for Bryant)?

    4) Any feedback on the reputation of Andy's Statewide (Orion) Vs Top Notch Mechanical (Waterford) regarding solving post installation problems (if this is against the rules, then please disregard). The BBB only lists Andy's with 2 resoloved issues.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Westlake, Ohio
    Posts
    2,470
    If you are comfortable having cold air blowing out of your registers and the highest gas bill on the block either one will work.
    captain CO

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    29
    So what you're saying is that both of these systems which claim to be high-comfort solutions are really mis-leading the consumer. Thus based upon the brevity of your statement I guess from a comfort viewpoint I'm better off keeping my 20 year old single stage single speed Goodman 70% and investing in T-notes to compensate for the difference in fuel costs...

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN, USA
    Posts
    33,929
    If you go the Carrier be sure to get the Infinity control for best operation of the 3 stages. York's furnace does it all off of a single stage stat, not my favorite idea but with logic and temp sensors it works. Personally either would do the job. The Infinity control can do more with airflow and dehumidifcation if that's of any interest.

    The issues with the Bryant/Carrier heat exchangers have been minor and are under warranty. Those furnaces are ALL OVER the place around here. We sure go through a lot of control boards but very rare to have a secondary heat exchanger problem on the 40" models, the ones sold today. The first generation 90s did have some issues with their secondary plugging up with junk & caulk.

    We never hear complaints of cold air from our 2 stage furnace sales and nobody has ever complained about gas bills going UP on multistage furnaces. Our former Rheem supplier said his gas bill went down going from a single stage 90 to Rheem's Modulator.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Eastern PA
    Posts
    68,923
    Modulating vs three stage is getting pretty sensitive. In theory, the modulating furnaces are going to be more comfortable. I also have not heard of cold air from the registers being an issue unless there is a problem with the way the systems have been set up.

    As far as the cost factor, staged furnaces can be more costly to operate if they are oversized. A properly sized staged furnace will provide both comfort and efficiency.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    210
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Davis View Post
    If you are comfortable having cold air blowing out of your registers and the highest gas bill on the block either one will work.
    Would you care to speak more about this? i have not heard of this being a issue. thanks.
    AIRFLOW IS CRITICAL

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Eastern PA
    Posts
    68,923
    Quote Originally Posted by airdata870 View Post
    Would you care to speak more about this? i have not heard of this being a issue. thanks.
    Ho boy, are you asking for it. Then again, I'm not sure if Captain CO is really much on discussing his views
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Rochester, MN
    Posts
    5,304
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Davis View Post
    If you are comfortable having cold air blowing out of your registers and the highest gas bill on the block either one will work.
    I too question about this too???

    Went from old single stage gas on a gas budget pay of $180 a month down to $88 a month on a two stage, and have nice warm air out of the vents, house is more comfortable now than it was with the single stage...

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Eastern PA
    Posts
    68,923
    Quote Originally Posted by mayguy View Post
    I too question about this too???

    Went from old single stage gas on a gas budget pay of $180 a month down to $88 a month on a two stage, and have nice warm air out of the vents, house is more comfortable now than it was with the single stage...
    The staging has nothing to do with your gas usage drop. That is strictly a factor of proper sizing and a more efficient furnace. Your comfort level increase is a direct result of the two stage feature, again along with the fact that your furnace has been properly sized.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  10. #10
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Suppy NC
    Posts
    4,513
    i may be wrong but i believe they are both stageing furnaces. York just has more stages then the others.

    I believe lennox is the only one that has a true modulating gas valve and the rest are staging.

    like i said i could be wrong

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Eastern PA
    Posts
    68,923
    Quote Originally Posted by tinknocker service tech View Post
    i may be wrong but i believe they are both stageing furnaces. York just has more stages then the others.

    I believe lennox is the only one that has a true modulating gas valve and the rest are staging.

    like i said i could be wrong
    As far as I know it is Rheem/Ruud that has the only truly modulating system that they have had out since the 1990's.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Louisville, KY
    Posts
    12,153
    Quote Originally Posted by RoBoTeq View Post
    As far as I know it is Rheem/Ruud that has the only truly modulating system that they have had out since the 1990's.
    Might want to read a bit about your new product line.

    Perhaps you should have read the instructions before calling.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Suppy NC
    Posts
    4,513
    Quote Originally Posted by RoBoTeq View Post
    As far as I know it is Rheem/Ruud that has the only truly modulating system that they have had out since the 1990's.

    the G-71 has a valve that will modulate up and down by the presure differantial accross the heatexchanger cause by the drat induce ramping up
    this is determined by the board

    it is also set to give the btu you need to heat your house and not run all the time.

    it ramps up and then off. And is controled by stat and time and the board determines what btu it starts at each time it starts and will modilate up from there at certain percentages

    i i remember right the rheem stages up and down determined by the stat. I am not sure it works off time also but it doent modulate from my understanding only stages

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