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  1. #14
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    Jan 2004
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    Lancaster PA
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    According to his other post, his winter rate after 750 KWH is 3.74 cents.
    Making electrice resistance heat cheaper then gas.
    Plus, he can still get the benefit of the heat pump with electric aux heat when the OD temps are below design.

    Heat pump with electric aux will cost less to heat with, then dual fuel.
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  2. #15
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    Jun 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by beenthere View Post
    According to his other post, his winter rate after 750 KWH is 3.74 cents.
    Making electrice resistance heat cheaper then gas.
    Plus, he can still get the benefit of the heat pump with electric aux heat when the OD temps are below design.

    Heat pump with electric aux will cost less to heat with, then dual fuel.
    OK - I remember that now. 3.74 cents per kw-hr is really dirt cheap.

    Would you have any concerns that the heat pump would run almost non-stop on brutally cold days?

    Take care.

  3. #16
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    Jan 2004
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    Lancaster PA
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    Not if the right thermostat was used and proper set up was done.

    Around here, a lot of heat pumps don't shut of at design temps. But its not like the temp is at design for a month at a time.

    The CPH of the aux heat can be set lower then first stage. That will cause the aux heat to satisfy the heat demand.
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  4. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    NW AR
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    Dual fuel (gas) may be a better option for your location.

    Sized correctly, electric backup can heat your house. Your call.

  5. #18
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    Jan 2004
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    Lancaster PA
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    67,761
    [quote=ar_hvac_man;1996929]Dual fuel (gas) may be a better option for your location.

    quote]

    What makes you think that?
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  6. #19
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Kingston Ontario Canada
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    1,210
    Quote Originally Posted by skippedover View Post
    This is a joke answer, right? 80% of the heat in the air is still available at zero-degrees. Absolute zero is well below that you might remember from thermodynamics class, -459*F. So a HP can pick up a lot of heat at temps. below 25 or 30. Whether it has sufficient capacity to heat the space is subject to proper sizing and installation. And I seriously doubt that the amount of gas you burn in So. California would heat a Nebraska home for 24-hours in the dead of winter.

    Using a HP alone in Nebraska for the dead of winter is probably not a good idea, unless it's a geo-thermal properly installed. Otherwise I'd recommend a dual-fuel system, whereby you take advantage of the HP during the milder days and use the fossil fuel system for the coldest weather. You need to do your homework as to the efficiency of gas versus electric heat in your area. You can choose from natural gas, if available, propane gas, fuel oil if available or electric resistance heat. A good HVAC company that does dual fuel systems will be able to help you with that, so your job is to find a good company. Start that process by polling by telephone each company in the phone book and accept for bids only those companies that answer the question appropriately. The question is, "How do you size a furnace or air conditioning system for a home?" The only acceptable answers are those that refer to a heat gain/loss analysis. All other methods, by experience, by square footage or similar should be rejected out of hand.
    Skippedover: That is a great answer to the HO's question. One of the best I have ever read on here....

    thorton
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  7. #20

    Thanks, but........

    Now I'm more confused than ever. Some say go with the electric heat strips, others say go with the dual fuel system. Is there any way to know for sure which would be the best system from a comfort and efficiency standpoint? Or, should I just choose one and hope it works out? As you are all aware, this is a major expense and I would surely like to get it right the first time.
    I really do appreciate the advice each has given so far.

    Neal

  8. #21
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Poestenkill, NY
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    769
    Quote Originally Posted by mountainrivers View Post
    Now I'm more confused than ever. Some say go with the electric heat strips, others say go with the dual fuel system. Is there any way to know for sure which would be the best system from a comfort and efficiency standpoint? Or, should I just choose one and hope it works out? As you are all aware, this is a major expense and I would surely like to get it right the first time.
    I really do appreciate the advice each has given so far.

    Neal
    Re-read my first post.

    It has everything to do with YOUR fuel rates. You need to figure out which is cheaper to heat with for your rates - electric resistance or gas. That will be your back-up heat source.

    Any system type can be designed to give wonderful comfort, it's a matter of fuel type. And fuel type is an economic issue - which is cheapest with your rates?

    Judging from the comments on your fuel rates, it sounds like back-up strip electric heat is the way to go - provided your electric service can handle the load...

  9. #22
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Las Vegas,NV
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    744
    Quote Originally Posted by beenthere View Post
    According to his other post, his winter rate after 750 KWH is 3.74 cents.
    Making electrice resistance heat cheaper then gas.
    Plus, he can still get the benefit of the heat pump with electric aux heat when the OD temps are below design.

    Heat pump with electric aux will cost less to heat with, then dual fuel.
    I think beenthere pretty much laid it out here, with the low electric rates you have, I have to agree.

  10. #23
    Thanks for all the expert advice. I have talked to my Lennox dealer and he agrees that with our current electric rates that I would be better off with the all-electric system, so I am going to go ahead with that. The only other question I had was whether there was any warranty on the old system, which is 19 years old and I am not the original owner. He said he would check with the factory on that and let me know. I also decided to upgrade to the XP15 system, which is a little more expensive, but has a rebate and the higher SEER allows me to get a $300 rebate from the electric company. I think that should allow me to just about break even on the upgrade.
    Again, thank you to all who offered advice. I love the internet.

    Neal

  11. #24
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    NW AR
    Posts
    2,478
    [QUOTE=beenthere;1996941]
    Quote Originally Posted by ar_hvac_man View Post
    Dual fuel (gas) may be a better option for your location.

    quote]

    What makes you think that?
    Its just my opinion. Hes in Nebraska with -double digits. I assume he has SOME gas appliances or he wouldnt even be considering a gas furnace.

    It rarely gets below 0 here so H.P.'s are the only way to go IMO, but if I lived up north I would opt for dual-fuel, assuming I already had gas service to my home.

    My generator could run a blower for a gas furnace. In extreme cold I would like that option. You aint gonna run elec. resist. heat with a genny.

  12. #25
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
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    67,761
    [QUOTE=ar_hvac_man;1998618]
    Quote Originally Posted by beenthere View Post

    Its just my opinion. Hes in Nebraska with -double digits. I assume he has SOME gas appliances or he wouldnt even be considering a gas furnace.

    It rarely gets below 0 here so H.P.'s are the only way to go IMO, but if I lived up north I would opt for dual-fuel, assuming I already had gas service to my home.

    My generator could run a blower for a gas furnace. In extreme cold I would like that option. You aint gonna run elec. resist. heat with a genny.
    But does the OP have a generator, if not, he'll spend more for heating using gas, then electric aux.
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  13. #26
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    The Twilight Zone
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    I believe that choices are a good thing.

    He may have cheap electric rates now, like we did in Maryland up until a year ago. But our rates were jacked up 72% thanks to de-regulation without competition. If the OPs electric rates shoot up, he's stuck with no choice of alternate fuel (unless he uses a wood stove, pellet stove, etc.). If he goes dual-fuel, he has a choice.

    Plus, his cheap rate is after the first 750 kw. So from 1 kw-hr to 749 kw-hr, strip heat is more expensive than gas.

    I realize that going straight electric saves him the purchase cost of the gas furnace.

    Just my 2 cents.

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