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  1. #1

    Newbie R410 Troubleshooting Question

    I apologize if this is old hat but any help would be greatly appreciated as I'm EPA certified but not well versed in R410. We had a complete system installed about 2 years ago still under warranty, hence my reluctance to work on it myself.

    Yesterday the indoor temp was rising with both the air-handler and condensing unit running. The tech taped up some gaps on the indoor unit and added some refrigerant.

    Today, although maintaining 77 degrees, the unit is running near constantly. Ambient is 95 degrees and we're getting a split of near 20 degrees. The outdoor unit sits in the shade and the air coming off the condenser is 108 degrees.

    My question is really about head pressure. When I looked at the gauges the tech had on the unit I noticed a "normal" suction pressure of about 150psig but head pressure was 490psig and am concerned that this is too high.

    Again, sorry to re-hash topics but I have much to learn and I've heard great things about this site. Thanks for any help provided!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Linn Creek, Mo
    Posts
    399
    1
    Last edited by jid1877; 07-20-2008 at 07:35 PM.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Round Rock
    Posts
    3,587
    Hard to say without looking at entire setup. Head pressure sounds a bit high too me. Possibly a restriction or bad expansion valve. I've been replacing a a fair amount of them lately on equipment about the same age.

  4. #4
    Return Temp is 76.8
    Supply Temp is 58
    Suction Line Temp is 67
    Liquid Line Temp is 99
    Suction Pressure 150
    Head Pressure 490

    I appreciate you taking the time to help, thanks! Without some required tools that I currently don't have access to, I don't think I'll be able to acquire all that you ask. However, later in the week, I will post all the data you asked.

    I assume that liquid pressure is the same as head/discharge pressure and that SH is Suprheat and SC is Subcool?

    The unit was serviced 4 months ago and the coils were inspected but not cleaned. Upon visual inspection I see through the coils and while not indicating they are "clean" it does apprear that they're not obstructed.

    Thanks again for taking the time and being patient. When I return from my business trip, I will post all data aked.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Western NC
    Posts
    2,504
    So your EPA certified but not an HVAC technician is what you are saying.


    This is not a DIY site, Read the Rules. If your tech couldn't find the problem, then you need to call the contractor back and have them send out another tech.

    Your head pressure seems high. Suction pressures seem in range for a R-410A unit. Without knowing CFM, Static Pressures, SH/SC, etc.etc..., we cannot diagnose your problems.


    However, if refrigerant was added to a 2 year old system, then more than likely there is a leak. And that would be first and foremost on your list. Make them perform a leak search and find out where the system is leaking from.




    Addition:

    Your superheat is 14 and your subcooling is 35. High Subcooling....should be closer to 10-15.
    I fully support the military and the War on Terrorism.


    If you don't know, then don't do. If you don't know and still do, then be prepared to pay someone else a lot to undo what you did and then do it right.

    If you do know, then do. But do it right. Otherwise, you may not be doing it long.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by iraqveteran View Post
    So your EPA certified but not an HVAC technician is what you are saying.


    This is not a DIY site, Read the Rules. If your tech couldn't find the problem, then you need to call the contractor back and have them send out another tech.
    Thanks, and I DID read the rules!

    I wasn't asking on how to fix it myself! I was asking so I was knowledable about the information I received from the Tech when they do come back out. Thanks for the "help"....

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    S. Cal, Palm Springs area
    Posts
    29
    sounds like your overcharged or the TXV is stuck closed. This is not a leak. To bring the temps between the liquid line and the condensation temp closer together (10-15 degrees) the pressure must go down and the temp of the liquid line must come up. Make sure you are hooked up and have a meter with a thermocouple attached to the liquid line. If the head pressure stays high, try tapping the TXV with a wrench, you might get lucky and hear the freon "breaking" loose inside. Let me know how it goes.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    S. Cal, Palm Springs area
    Posts
    29
    sounds like your overcharged or the TXV is stuck closed. This is not a leak. To bring the temps between the liquid line and the condensation temp closer together (10-15 degrees) the pressure must go down and the temp of the liquid line must come up. Make sure you are hooked up and have a meter with a thermocouple attached to the liquid line. If the head pressure stays high, try tapping the TXV with a wrench, you might get lucky and hear the freon "breaking" loose inside. Let me know how it goes.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Mn the state where absolutey nothing is allowed
    Posts
    1,360
    why did the "tech" add refrigerant?,,that didnt fix anything did it. you may have two problems now.. time to start over

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    623
    Quote Originally Posted by airdesignguy View Post
    sounds like your overcharged or the TXV is stuck closed. This is not a leak. To bring the temps between the liquid line and the condensation temp closer together (10-15 degrees) the pressure must go down and the temp of the liquid line must come up. Make sure you are hooked up and have a meter with a thermocouple attached to the liquid line. If the head pressure stays high, try tapping the TXV with a wrench, you might get lucky and hear the freon "breaking" loose inside. Let me know how it goes.
    Yes, I agree. As with anything that is not working, I do recommend striking it with a blunt object, Nothing wrong with a little attitude adjustment.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    623
    now overcharged.
    Last edited by aintitfun; 07-20-2008 at 10:00 PM.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    mesa arizona
    Posts
    309

    Hmm yo

    got one................ puron 410 carrier system...split 5 ton bad split only 10 degrees,,,,,,,,good sweating on suction line...any ideas???.....

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    623
    Quote Originally Posted by raidersfan7 View Post
    got one................ puron 410 carrier system...split 5 ton bad split only 10 degrees,,,,,,,,good sweating on suction line...any ideas???.....
    Well gee I dont know, I guess if the suction line is SWEATING , it must be workin fine, I reckon.

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