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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    western Missouri
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    Hmm I have to decide now.... Ground source or..

    Going to be a long one here. So let's get started. I will say in advance "Thank you all".
    History of all this begins with:
    My house burned down in 2005 and was rebuilt. Moved in in 2006. The house has 2x6 exterior walls, pella high end windows, 2100 square feet main level ranch, 9 to 11 feet tall ceilings and 2100 walk out basement finished for a total of 4200 sqft. Now I wish I would have done all this ground source thing when rebuilding but I didn't know I was under insured by $54000. I purchased a 90% propane furnace and a 13 seer air source heat pump which is set to heat down to 35 degrees. Both are Lennox brand.I live in western Missouri. I have completed the calculations on what it costs to heat and cool my house over the last 18 months. The annual cost is $3468. I use an average of 1600KWh per month at a cost of .0919 for the first 600kwh, .0496 for the next 400 kwh and .0411 for the remaining. I am on a level payment for electricity of $135.00 per month.
    Now for propane. I have calculated that I have used 1235 gallons over the same period. I use propane for the furnace and the hot water heater. The current price per gallon for propane is $2.24 per gallon. I expect that to only increase.
    Now for the investment question. It's going to cost me $20,400 bucks to install a Florida Heat Pump Envirosaver ES with desuperheater and two stage scroll compressor with closed ground loops. What's your opinion on this unit? A 23.5 EER for cooling with water temp entering at 77 degrees and in part load(1400) and a cop of 4.0 for heating with water temp entering at 32 degrees. The water temps should enter at around 55 degrees shouldn't they?
    Which I think would increase efficiency. The local electric company will kick in $850.00.
    Additional costs are: 10 year warranty parts and labor $933.00 gotta have.
    High efficiency air filter $250 mineas well.
    Pipe in outside air circulation $850 want this to.
    For a total of $21,600. Plus I'll need to get an electric hot water heater and use my propane one as a buffer tank storage tank.
    Now the contractors print out says that I will only spend $881.00 per year to heat and cool. This is where I have a problem. $3468 - 881 = $2587 savings.
    $881 per year is only $74.00 per month. Which if all this is correct GREAT.
    But still about a 9 or 10 year break even point depending on final bill. They always seem to be more. Like if we hit rock when trenching.
    Is this in line or not. I was expecting about a 6 or 7 year break even point.
    Would you do this?
    Thank you again,

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Maple Ridge, B.C.
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    Tough to say when exactly your break even point will come- keep in mind the fuels will change prices at a different rate as well. The other thing to remember is that yourr geo unit will also preheat your hot water getting you more savings as your hot water tank will not be on as much therefore further lowering your gas bill. This is free heat as it is run thru a desuperheater which takes heat off the top side of the compressor. I have never installed a Florida heat pump, only worked on them and they seemed like decent units as far as quality goes. I'm not too sure about the climate where you are but with your newer house with good windows 2x6 walls and good insulation may never require your backup heat to come on, further saving you money. ( its pretty much a guarantee that if your backup heat does come on, it will do so at a much lower temp then 35*f.) My personal opinion is that if you have the means to go geo, and you plan on staying in your house for a long time it's pretty much a no brainer to do so.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    southern IN
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    As for the price.Can't say due to regional price differences.
    With the numbers you posted,I would think it would be a good investment. I tell my customers the job of their first geo is to pay for iself and its replacement.Then you will start making money with the next unit If yu are planning on staying in the house might as well quit giving all your money to utility companies.
    I was a little suprised hat the P&L wtty and filter were extra.
    I am sure you did,but did you check references.
    The first man gets the pearl, All the second gets is the shell

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