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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Suburb of Chicago
    Posts
    9

    Anyone have any information on K-Way products soda chiller setups?

    Hi all,
    New guy here in the Chicago area trying to find a manual or some hook up info for a soda machine setup.

    My main background is auto's & light to medium duty trucks, I've been a Ford tech at the dealership level for close to 20 years and worked on Nissan's 13 years prior to that.
    So doing A/C work in a car or truck is not really a problem for me, done a little bit on home units also.
    But what I need is some info on a product made by a company that from what I can tell, has recently gone out of business.

    I wanted to have a home soda dispenser setup, so I recently acquired a complete remote chiller system with bargun, from a bar that went out of business in Michigan. Problem is, there is no diagram for hook-up on the chiller, plus there is no info on what mix ratio to use of USP propylene glycol in the recirculation line to the bargun and back.

    And of course when they took the system out of the bar, they cut just about every water and syrup line off of the places where they were connected, leaving only about a inch or so. So now I get to trace the lines and connections to hook it all back back up, by trying to match up colors and stripes on the cut off lines and connectors.

    The tag on the chiller/cooler unit says it is a K-Way Products model KW3-A style # 71300-010

    What I would like to do is pick up a manual, or at least a diagram to set this system up. And also get the info for the proper mix ratio of the propylene glycol.
    Figuring out the lines is not going to stall the project, it will just slow it down a bit. As I was hoping to just buy a new bundle of lines, and have a diagram of some sort.
    Worse comes to worse, I'll have to study all the cut lines and connectors, and I will end up having to draw up my own diagram for that.


    Thanks in advance for any help I can get on this.


    John
    Last edited by Johnla; 07-05-2008 at 04:58 AM.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    North Queensland, Australia
    Posts
    1,051
    Gedday John. I don't know the make or model of your machine but for a few years I looked after the local Pepsi post mix gear. The chiller in their and cokes stuff is an ice bank and doesn't use glycol. Water only. I'd check that before filling it if I were you. On the other hand, the beer reticulation systems here do use glycol.
    Good luck.
    Mistakes are a part of being human. Appreciate your mistakes for what they are: precious life lessons that can only be learned the hard way. Unless it's a fatal mistake, which, at least, others can learn from. Al Franken, "Oh, the Things I Know", 2002

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    wedged in freezer shelf
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    7,208
    How are you going to control your kids ?
    “If You Can Dodge A Wrench You Can Dodge A Ball”

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    North Queensland, Australia
    Posts
    1,051
    Quote Originally Posted by itsiceman View Post
    How are you going to control your kids ?
    just back from holidays Ice. The brains not up to speed yet...
    Mistakes are a part of being human. Appreciate your mistakes for what they are: precious life lessons that can only be learned the hard way. Unless it's a fatal mistake, which, at least, others can learn from. Al Franken, "Oh, the Things I Know", 2002

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Suburb of Chicago
    Posts
    9
    Quote Originally Posted by Slatts View Post
    Gedday John. I don't know the make or model of your machine but for a few years I looked after the local Pepsi post mix gear. The chiller in their and cokes stuff is an ice bank and doesn't use glycol. Water only. I'd check that before filling it if I were you. On the other hand, the beer reticulation systems here do use glycol.
    Good luck.
    No, I understand what you are saying but I'm not so sure it uses just water and not a glycol/water mix. Because this one does not seem have the typical ice bank system, where you also have chilled syrup lines running out of it. It looks very much like the beer system you mention, except that it also has a internal carbonator unit inside. It appears to only cool the the lines leading up to the bargun and also the output of the carbonated water line. It only has one input and two outputs. It has one input for the supply water, and it has the output for carbonated water, and then the other output is the recirculation one for chilling the entire bundle of lines. Also I have seen somewhere that it was rated to chill up to 100ft of line leading to a bargun, so that one line would have to get very cold to do that. Most ice bank systems I have seen, have also have one set of in and out lines for each flavor of syrup, so a six flavor unit would also have six syrup lines going into it and also coming out of it for just the syrups.

    This is why I'm trying to find some real information on it, because it so completely different from all the other remote soda chillers I have seen.

    This is the only place I have seen any mention of the chiller, and they claim it is "the only recirculating dry refrigerated soda system on the market."
    But they also look like they are only a reseller and installer, and not the actual manufacturer of the chiller.
    And I emailed them twice and never got any reply back from them. And the links that they also have there to the official K-Way products website are dead.

    http://www.kwaysystems.com/soda.cfm


    Like I mentioned before, it seems that K-Way/SYCA products has gone out of business as far as I can tell.
    Because there was some sort of a foreclosure on their property just over year ago from what I have found.

    Maybe tomorrow I will take the entire top of the chiller off and see what it really looks like inside, so far I have just taken off the plate that only has the wiring diagram inside of it. I was hoping that it would also have had a flow chart/diagram for the liquid lines, but it did not.
    Last edited by Johnla; 07-06-2008 at 03:04 AM.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    44
    Some of the old soda systems that were in use would actually just pump water from the ice bath in a loop through the lines to keep the syrup and water lines cooled. There are still systems used alot today that pump soda water up to the dispenser and back in a continous loop that also "feeds" the gunits soda water, so they actually have 2 functions. You say it has a built in carbonator, does it have one or two 1/3hp motors with pumps? And if it has 2 is one of them brass and the other stainless steel? The brass pump would feed plain water to the carbonator tank ands the stainless system would circulate soda for dispensing and cooling. How many lines total are in the bundle?
    ccnova

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Suburb of Chicago
    Posts
    9
    I did not get to taking the cover off yet, however the label on the chiller states that it has two 1/3hp motors inside for powering pumps. One is for the carbonator and the other is for the compressor. I'm probably going to use around 5-6 lines for the amount flavors I want to have, and not counting the ones also needed for the carbonated water and the chilled recirculated water, which would be 3 more for that. But as far as the total amount of lines in the bundle go, it really don't make much difference because the only lines that go from the bargun to the chiller, are the carbonated water output and the ones for the recirculation of cooled water to chill all the surrounding syrup lines within the bundle of lines. No syrup lines whatsoever actually hook up to the chiller unit itself, they come direct from the syrup pumps. As far as the age of it. This is not a very old unit, the manufacture date on the label shows it as being made in 5/03.

    Not knowing what your rules are here for posting pictures within a post, I will just tell you what the link is to view them.

    This is a clear pic of the label on it.

    http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/m...nd/K-Way_1.jpg

    This is a rather poor cellphone camera pic of the back where the all in/out lines are. The two red lines are for the recirculation of chilled water in the entire bundle of lines, and the other two, one is for the intake of normal tap water, and the other is for the output of the carbonated water.

    http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/m...20-08_1649.jpg

    This is some pics, of the entire mess of cut line bundles, two barguns, and the syrup pumps that I also got with the unit.

    http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/m.../K-Way_3-2.jpg

    http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/m.../K-Way_4-2.jpg

    http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/m...20-08_1701.jpg

    As for the line bundle, I will replace that with a new one. Because I'm not too happy the way it still has syrup residue in it, and I feel it would be much safer to buy new lines instead of trying to clean out and sanitize the old ones. This setup was last used up until just last April of this year, in a bar/club that closed down and went out of business in Michigan. So it's been in storage like the pics show with the lines cut for roughly the last 2 months, and that left over syrup is rather messy.
    Last edited by Johnla; 07-08-2008 at 06:35 AM.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    44
    From what I see on the name plate you have two 1/3hp motors and the compressor. I would guess that one pump is brass and feeds plain water to the carbonator and the other pumps something through the bundle to cool the syrup and water. What ever it pumps will probably just go up one tube to a u-bend close to the gun and then back to be cooled again. I work for Coca-Cola and all our systems similar to this use only plain water or soda water to circulate and cool. I have never seen a soda system in this part of the country or anywhere that uses glycol. The only place I have seen that is in beer systems and some remote ice cream dispensors. As for what they mean by a "dry refrigerated" system I have seen some old systems that used a mechanically refrigerated block of aluminum with coils imbedded in it to cool as opposed to a water bath system. Maybe thats what this has? Find out which pump goes to the carbonator tank and then follow the lines to and from the other pump to see where the inlet goes. I'm sorry but thats all I can say for now. I will ask around and see if I can find any more info.
    ccnova

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    North Queensland, Australia
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    Quote Originally Posted by ccnova View Post
    From what I see on the name plate you have two 1/3hp motors and the compressor. I would guess that one pump is brass and feeds plain water to the carbonator and the other pumps something through the bundle to cool the syrup and water. What ever it pumps will probably just go up one tube to a u-bend close to the gun and then back to be cooled again. I work for Coca-Cola and all our systems similar to this use only plain water or soda water to circulate and cool. I have never seen a soda system in this part of the country or anywhere that uses glycol. The only place I have seen that is in beer systems and some remote ice cream dispensors.
    ccnova
    I concur.
    Water. Not glycol.
    Mistakes are a part of being human. Appreciate your mistakes for what they are: precious life lessons that can only be learned the hard way. Unless it's a fatal mistake, which, at least, others can learn from. Al Franken, "Oh, the Things I Know", 2002

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Suburb of Chicago
    Posts
    9
    Yes you are 100% right about the cooled line doing a "U-turn" right at the bargun in order to recirculate the cooled water. I guess I'll remove the cover sometime later this week take a look inside and see if I can find out anything else about it. And order up a new bundle of lines, over trying to clean the old used ones. And then assume I need to just use water. I guess the worst thing that could happen is that it could maybe freeze up and burst the recirculation lines if it did need a water/gycol mix, so I'll just keep a close eye on it for the first few hours, and then for the first couple of days.

    Anyway, thanks for the help guys.
    And if any of you do happen to come up with any other sort of information, especially if it pertains to this exact K-Way system. Please come back and post it.

    Thanks again!


    John

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    wedged in freezer shelf
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnla View Post
    Anyway, thanks for the help guys.
    And if any of you do happen to come up with any other sort of information, especially if it pertains to this exact K-Way system. Please come back and post it.

    Thanks again!


    John
    John

    I still think your opening Pandora's BIB (ccnova )


    Dress your kids in sweaters and put some Velcro on the ceilings.

    Your gona have every kid in the neighborhood at your place



    Better put in a tapper while your at it

    to help the adults cope



    “If You Can Dodge A Wrench You Can Dodge A Ball”

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Suburb of Chicago
    Posts
    9
    I have no children of my own, so I'm not too worried about having all the kids in the neighborhood at my house bugging me for free soda. I do however have grown up adult friends over quite a bit to watch movies, which is why I also have a fairly nice theater type popcorn machine.

    Hmmm, that's the same kind of stuff that kids like. OK, OK, lets just call it a bunch of grown up kids that do show up....

    One thing nice I found when looking for BIB syrup suppliers, is that there is one local to me and only about 10 minutes away from me that sells to the public and also carries the syrup mix in BIB for Green River soda. I used to love that soda, but it became almost impossible to find other than for around the 3 or 4 weeks right before each St. Patrick's Day. Problem is, they are the R/C Cola distributor for the area and I don't want that. I want Coke, they do however also have 7up and Dr Pepper which I want. So that leaves just Squirt, and also a name brand of root beer. Plus a non-carbonated lemonade. I know I can get Coke BIB at Sams, but I'm trying to find if there are also other local options other than just Sams for any of the Coke brands.

    John

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    14
    Confirmed. U have a water bath filled with water and only water. Fill it up to the top of the overflow tube inside. Don't know how big your system is but you will have one brass and one stainless steel pump. The brass procon is used to pressurize the water before it enters the carbonator tank and meet with the co2 therefore making soda water. So your carbonator tank will either be in the water bath or somewhere remote but eventually the water will enter coils in the bath. From there depending on how many lines you have in the bundle tubing or python and how many flavors you are planning to run that will determine how many times you want to loop that soda circuit inside the python. Your soda water will be recirculated with the stainless steel pump. The stainless pump will suck from the tank from the inlet side of the pump and push soda water to your tower or dispensing valves. At your tower no matter how many valves you have you should have a u type of flow in and out of the tower. From there it will return to your stainless steel pump with a check valve before entering the pump again so you don't have soda h2o back to your brass pump.. The more you loop your soda the colder it will be. The kways are similar to the Mcdonalds Multiplex unit now owned by servend. Check their site lots of good info there. Good luck but in my honest opinion get rid of that thing and pick yourself what they call a counter electric unit. Basically a 1/4 to 3/4 hp reefer deck sitting inside a miniature water bath.. Lot smaller less power to run and less parts to replace. Barguns have the worst tasting soda there is it out there.. They contaminate with pungent syrups very easily . If you want want to use the barguns pick yourselk a cold plate. Your syrups/drinks run thru the coldplate and ice over the coldplate will cool your drinks.

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