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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    34

    I need two furnaces and two condensors. Sizing correct?

    I need to buy 2 furnaces and 2 AC condensors.

    1257 square feet Downstairs

    1660 square feet Upstairs


    (These are my bids... they all include two basic conventional furnaces and two 13 SEER condensors with each brand.)



    Company A = Goodman (2.5 and 3 ton), R22, new line set, media filter

    Company A = TempStar (2.5 and 3 ton), R22, new line set, media filter


    Company B = Trane XB (2 and 3 ton), R410a, new line set, media filter

    Company B = ComfortStar, (2 and 3 ton), R410a, new line set, media filter


    Company C = Lennox XC (2 and 2 ton), R410a, same old lines


    Company D = Carrier comfort series (2.5 and 3 ton), R410a


    Company E = Amana (2 and 3 ton), R410a, new line set, media filter


    Company F = Lennox XC (2 and 2.5 tons), R410a, new line set, media filter


    Company G = Trane XR (2 and 2.5 ton), R410a, same old lines



    I deleted prices, not allowed?


    Any and all thoughts, chime in.


    Trane versus Lennox?


    Trane XB versus Trane XR?


    Lennox XC?


    What about sizing? 2 tons downstairs and 3 tons upstairs?


    What about install? One company says 2 days, another says 4 days.


    1257 square feet Downstairs

    1660 square feet Upstairs

    Is it 600 sq feet per ton?


    I think 2 tons for 1257 feet is a little small?

    What about 3 tons for 1660 feet? Oversized?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Lincoln, Nebraska
    Posts
    1,051
    The only way to properly size the house is for the contractor to do a manual J load calculation. Sizing should not be done on a square foot basis. To do a manual J the contractor would have had to measure all windows, doors, rooms, insulation and such. Did any of them do this? Otherwise it is just a guess.

    As far as equipment goes it is much more the installation than brand name. Go with whoever you trust the most and get references.
    Its a good Life!

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    Posts
    2,176
    Definitely go with the 410-A systems. DO NOT REUSE THE LINESETS!!! My personal preference would be the Trane or Carrier units. Figure on worst case scenario for installation of 2 systems (2-3 days since line sets can be difficult to replace if in finished walls or ceilings). Sizing should be ok at 2 and 3 tons.

    Hope this helps!

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Lincoln, Nebraska
    Posts
    1,051
    And how do you know the sizing is correct? Whats wrong with the other brands if installed properly.
    Its a good Life!

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    68,797
    You got estimates ranging from 4 tons to 5 1/2 tons.

    Did any of them do a load calc?

    If you use a rule of thumb, you can end up with a house is 82°F, or a house that is 70°F and 70%RH.

    If none of them did a load calc. Keep calling.
    Contractor locator map

    How-to-apply-for-Professional

    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    Posts
    2,176
    Quote Originally Posted by m kilgore View Post
    And how do you know the sizing is correct? Whats wrong with the other brands if installed properly.
    Sorry, I didn't want to get into a brand war. There is absolutely nothing wrong with the other brands if they are installed properly. I'm basing my opinion on 15 years service experience, and I've seen my fair share of shoddy installs as well as yourself.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    DFW
    Posts
    684
    Quote Originally Posted by Clorox View Post

    I think 2 tons for 1257 feet is a little small?

    What about 3 tons for 1660 feet? Oversized?
    In North central Texas
    My old house required 5 tons for 2,000 sq. ft. or one ton for every 400 sq. ft.
    My new house requires 2 tons for 4,000 sq. ft. or one ton for every 2,000 sq. ft.

    Your house will probably be somewhere between those two numbers.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    68,797
    Quote Originally Posted by phbsales View Post
    and I've seen my fair share of shoddy installs as well as yourself.
    Shoddy installs begin with guessing that the size should be ok.
    Contractor locator map

    How-to-apply-for-Professional

    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    Posts
    2,176
    Agreed.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    SW Wisconsin
    Posts
    5,034
    CLOROX:
    What about sizing? 2 tons downstairs and 3 tons upstairs?

    What about install? One company says 2 days, another says 4 days.

    1257 square feet Downstairs

    1660 square feet Upstairs

    Is it 600 sq feet per ton?

    I think 2 tons for 1257 feet is a little small?

    What about 3 tons for 1660 feet, - Over-sized?
    Ask all of them precisely what they are going to do in respect to the installs!
    Ask why it will take either 2 or 4 days to install the units.

    Ask if they are going to check the duct systems & that proper airflow will be delivered at the air handlers' (plate) Rated ESP!

    Know what you want done & what they are willing to do before you accept any bid!

    I personally, would want a Copeland Scroll compressor & a Thermostatic Expansion Valve on BOTH UNITS.

    No need to oversize the units, as you can always do things to lower the heat-gain & air infiltration situation.
    http://www.udarrell.com/external_sta..._readings.html

    Work hard & oversee the install, to get it Done RIGHT the first Time.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    16

    Waisting People Time

    with all the bids you are waisting peoples time and getting very confused. You should rely on a dealer that has been around and will service after the sale. 75% dealer reputation 25% equipment.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Central Maryland
    Posts
    246
    Quote Originally Posted by Doubled8 View Post
    with all the bids you are waisting peoples time and getting very confused. You should rely on a dealer that has been around and will service after the sale. 75% dealer reputation 25% equipment.
    On "wasting" time and reputations...

    The dealer most recommended to me is the one that already overcharged my linted-up system by two pounds and then installed a hard start capacitor to compensate. Four years of high electric bills and hundreds circuit breaker resets later, I tried to get 7 or 8 bids, got 5 IIRC.

    None of them did a Manual J.

    I picked the one that got MOST of the things right listed on this and the ARI web page. He was the LAST bid.

    Who was wasting who's time?

    -HF

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    34
    Quote Originally Posted by udarrell View Post

    Ask why it will take either 2 or 4 days to install the units.
    Arrive at 9:00am and leave at 3:30pm

    Two days for the 2nd floor and two days for the first floor.

    Is this normal?

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