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  1. #1

    unethical repairman?

    I am new to this forumn and by no means an expert in hvac. My conversations with the local "pro's" have left me confused and possibly baffled by B.S. Here is my situation. I have an Armstrong 2 1/2 ton, 10 seer heat pump (model # SHP10a30a-1b) that was installed new in '96. The windings in the compressor shorted out causing the breaker to trip and hince no more cool air. I live in south central Kansas by the way. A local "pro" wants to replace the outside unit with a Weatherking 2 1/2 ton, 13 seer unit (model # 13PJA30a01). I stressed the importance of the inside and outside units needing to be matched, and I was told that they would be. I didn't think it was possible to mix the seer ratings like this. Wouldn't that leave an undersized coil and lineset? I tried to contact Weatherking on the internet, but you have to be a distributer. The manufacturers warranty says 5 year limited, the "pro" says 1 year. In addition, the manufacturers warranty is VOID if the system is not matched properly or meet certain specifications. Unfortunately money is a big issue right now as I am trying to recover from a major back surgery. However, I do not want to throw money away on a "guesswork" system that will end up costing me a great deal more in the long run with multiple service calls and repair bills.
    Any help or advise will be greatly appreciated!

    thanx,

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    The Twilight Zone
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    2,964
    Sounds like you are more informed than your "pro".

    Anyway to replace just the compressor, and not the whole condenser?

    Good luck.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
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    Houston,Tx.
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    16,121
    Quote Originally Posted by gary_g View Post
    Sounds like you are more informed than your "pro".

    Anyway to replace just the compressor, and not the whole condenser?

    Good luck.

    Replace compressor in an existing condenser thats suffered a burnout? that could be one of those good ideas that turns into a bad idea.
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  4. #4
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX
    Posts
    11,376
    Seems as if you're relying heavily on this one person's opinion of your system. Get at least two or three more separate bids and consider each before you make a decision.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    PA
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    68,764
    Get other contractor to give estimate.
    You want a matching system.
    I know you like this guys cheap price. But forget it, it will cost you more in the long run.
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    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

  6. #6
    In the original post I was just guessing. thanx for verification. I live pretty far away from a major town (50+ miles). Honestly I didn't want to waste anyone's time and money to drive out and give bids with gas prices what they are. What would happen to the mis-matched system? Would the undersized coil and lineset be a big issue? Would the compressor burn up or leak from to high of pressure? Would the inside unit now be damaged somehow? Would the system be overworked? Would the heat Pump work perfectly for a hundred years? Would it work just long enough for the check to clear the bank?
    thanx again people!

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    va
    Posts
    800
    Lemme give my opinion....It's a 12 year old system, for a heat pump, it's past it's useful life or "wore out". Replace both indoor and outdoor unit. If money IS a problem, you can replace the compressor for a quick fix, just make sure the installer removes the indoor & outdoor piston and flushes the system out and makes sure that the "little hole" inside the piston is clear, (assuming it's a piston and not TXV) as well as check both coils for cleanliness, then install a suction line drier in the suction line just before it goes into the compressor. Just my 2 cents.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Round Rock
    Posts
    3,652
    You can install the new condenser (outside) with the older air handler (inside) and it will work to some degree. You won't be getting the full efficiency, but it will cool. It is preferable to put in a matched system, but if you don't have the money, you don't have the money, what can you do? I wouldn't consider replacing just the compressor. It's too old to waste your money. It will be close to replacing the entire condenser in cost and the warranty will be 1 year. The only way anybody will know about the conditions of the setup for the warranty is if your contractor "rats" you out. Nobody will come out to inspect the setup from Ruud. If he will do that, then dump his arse, he's a POS. I would do as much as you can afford right now, save up and finish it within a reasonable amount of time and you should be fine.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Middle Tennessee
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    *

    Quote Originally Posted by bmathews View Post
    You can install the new condenser (outside) with the older air handler (inside) and it will work to some degree. You won't be getting the full efficiency, but it will cool. It is preferable to put in a matched system, but if you don't have the money, you don't have the money, what can you do? I wouldn't consider replacing just the compressor. It's too old to waste your money. It will be close to replacing the entire condenser in cost and the warranty will be 1 year. The only way anybody will know about the conditions of the setup for the warranty is if your contractor "rats" you out. Nobody will come out to inspect the setup from Ruud. If he will do that, then dump his arse, he's a POS. I would do as much as you can afford right now, save up and finish it within a reasonable amount of time and you should be fine.

    do you know what's gonna happen when he goes to use the heat the first time in winter!



    .

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    PA
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    Since its a heat pump. Read this before mismatching.
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  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Suppy NC
    Posts
    4,516
    seer isnt your main concern it realy comes down to coil surface
    is the indoor coil big enough or have enough surface to handle the ouside unit in heating mode. This is why matching the coils is so very important when it is a heat pump.

    yes if the coil isnt matched it can burn out the compressor
    yes you will have problems and spend a lot more
    yes the guy is foolish to even think it can work without any technical data on your indoor unit

    yes it most likely will cost more to operate heating and cooling

    I have seen it many times when people add a new condenser heat pump outside and not inside and then want to know what room should they give up for the tech to sleep in because he is always there

    replace it all and have a match system for and comfort for many years and with best operating costs

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    va
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    800
    Quote Originally Posted by bmathews View Post
    You can install the new condenser (outside) with the older air handler (inside) and it will work to some degree. You won't be getting the full efficiency, but it will cool. It is preferable to put in a matched system, but if you don't have the money, you don't have the money, what can you do? I wouldn't consider replacing just the compressor. It's too old to waste your money. It will be close to replacing the entire condenser in cost and the warranty will be 1 year. The only way anybody will know about the conditions of the setup for the warranty is if your contractor "rats" you out. Nobody will come out to inspect the setup from Ruud. If he will do that, then dump his arse, he's a POS. I would do as much as you can afford right now, save up and finish it within a reasonable amount of time and you should be fine.
    Correct on RUUD not comming out to inspect......but, after the compressor in the replacement weatherking unit fails through the first winter because of the mismatch, When the service man fills out the Rheem/RUUD warrenty claim form for a compressor, What will he put down on the line asking for the model and serial of the "matched" indoor unit, knowing it is not matched? I used to put in lots of Rheem/RUUD and Weatherking, and belive me, they are going to check all of the info on that sheet, and will not pay if anything is not right. I've had them reject claims because of a wrong house # or zip code....They check it all and verify!!! Another thing, most don't want to go back on equipment they put in, especially if it's going to haunt them like this will.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Round Rock
    Posts
    3,652
    I think the consensus is to replace everything if you can. But all that is a mute point if the dude can't afford too. Which he expressed towards the end of his post. If it is hot. You gotta do what you gotta do to cool down. Wintertime is still a few months away and saving money to purchase the other half of the match is a better option than sweating your asse off. Yes, you could have problems in the wintertime. But there is still the option of using strip heat for a while. And yes we all know it costs more to operate resistance heaters than a heat pump. But once again, everybody seems to forget, you gotta do what you gotta do if you don't have the $$$.

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