Question: What's the difference between Cooling & Heating Calculation Load?

[vaioman]

Hi i've been designing and do cooling load calculation in our country. Now, im here in the USA and there's snow and lots of freezing temperature.

my question is, if i compute for the cooling load (example 50TR to cool down the offices) is it the same load for the heating? I mean it's also 50TR for the HEAT required during winter/snow?


thank you in advance!

[karsthuntr]

Depends on were your located, the short answer is no, there are two different loads.

Look at it this way.

Indoor temp of 75 degs in summer, outside temp of 100 degs, thats a 25 deg difference.

Indoor temp of 70 degs in winter, outside temp of zero, thats a 70 deg difference.

[vaioman]

Depends on were your located, the short answer is no, there are two different loads.

Look at it this way.

Indoor temp of 75 degs in summer, outside temp of 100 degs, thats a 25 deg difference.

Indoor temp of 70 degs in winter, outside temp of zero, thats a 70 deg difference.

got it.

how about the equipment (ex. chiller or package AC units)....if i compute 50TR for cooling and 70TR for Heating if i bought the chiller or AC equipment, do i need to buy 70TR capacity with capable of doing HEATING and COOLING?

[beenthere]

You should intern for a design/engineering firm before you do this yourself.

[vaioman]

You should intern for a design/engineering firm before you do this yourself.

yup i'll work as entry level hvac engineer....but i want to know also the answer to my question....i can easily understand if you give me some idea.

thanks

[beenthere]

ALL equipment must be sized to meet the load requirement of the season it will operate for.

[vaioman]

ALL equipment must be sized to meet the load requirement of the season it will operate for.

yeah thats right.

thats why i give example....so i can't buy split type AC equipment (indoor unit + ACCU) that can do two things....HEAT during snow/winter/cold season and COOL during summer season?

i just wonder why my car AC system can do heating and cooling.

[beenthere]

Cause your car A/C doesn't heat the car.
Your cars heat comes from the engine, not the air conditioner.

There are units that can do both.
But since you want to design for commercial. You can't be taught how to do it online.

[vaioman]

There are units that can do both.

thanks!

if they can do both, what size or capacity should i select?....example 50TR for cooling required to cool down the offices and 70TR for heating to provide heat during winter season.

do i need to specify 50TR cooling and 70TR heating capacity i need to AC manufacturer?...or i'm good with just 70TR capacity?

[amickracing]

You're an engineer, it doesn't matter... just blame the guys who put it in when it doesn't work!

Sorry, ahem, I mean welcome aboard! lol

This is an interesting question, and honestly I don't have any "by the book" answers.

What I would say is this though, make sure you have enough heat to keep things comfortable, but since you're doing commercial, you'll almost always have way more need for cooling vs heating, which will lead your heating system to be plenty over sized.

[gruntly]

Let me complicate this for you...

One calculation is called heat gain and the other heat loss. There is no set size or load for a home, business or outhouse because the outdoor design temperature that is used to calculate heat loss or heat gain depends entirely on location on this planet's surface. Design humidity must also be taken into consideration. Insulation, building materials, occupancy, appliances all play a part in load calculations.

Load calculations are not a guessing game for those who need to do it right. In the case of residential, it's probably the difference between satisfying a customer or not... but in the world of commercial/industrial it can be several million dollars worth of difference. You either do it right... or don't do it.

It should be obvious to anyone who does them, that there would be a set of design temperatures/humidities for both, gain or loss.

[vaioman]

.

Load calculations are not a guessing game for those who need to do it right. In the case of residential, it's probably the difference between satisfying a customer or not... but in the world of commercial/industrial it can be several million dollars worth of difference. You either do it right... or don't do it. .

you're absolutely right.

guys, is there any online course to study ASHRAE heat load calculation?

[conork]

And the type of usage of the building will play a big part

The last thing you'd wanna do is get it completly wrong......Imagine having to rip it out after people have moved in.....The joys of it all

[hvacbear]

you're absolutely right.

guys, is there any online course to study ASHRAE heat load calculation?

Yes, but ASHRAE will probably be confusing at first take an ACCA manual "N" course for the basics.

What is your back ground?
Are you an engineer?
Do you have a AAS degree in HVAC?
Once you answer these questions I can help you a little more.

[vaioman]

Yes, but ASHRAE will probably be confusing at first take an ACCA manual "N" course for the basics.

What is your back ground?
Are you an engineer?
Do you have a AAS degree in HVAC?
Once you answer these questions I can help you a little more.

i've been designing Airconditioning system for almost 10years....my problem is i only do cooling load since there's no winter season in our country.

i'm mechanical engineer with licensed in our country.

i dont have problem with the cooling load, my problem is where i would start to learn how to do HEAT load computation.

thanks

[hvacbear]

i've been designing Airconditioning system for almost 10years....my problem is i only do cooling load since there's no winter season in our country.

i'm mechanical engineer with licensed in our country.

i dont have problem with the cooling load, my problem is where i would start to learn how to do HEAT load computation.

thanks

No need to yell I understand.
Check these out:

http://www.ashrae.org/education/page/1471
http://www.ashrae.org/education/page/1472

[vaioman]

thanks hvacbear.....

waiting for my 2books

another question, theres a lot of system that can used in cooling any area/space (using chilled water system, condense water system, split type, combination of chilled/condense water, etc)....

how about in heating a building or commercial area, what are the heating system source NORMALLY use base on reliability and low in cost?

PS. i guess in apartments or house its not too complicated to select a system.....furnace+baseboard or radiant heat or package AC unit (?)

thanks and appreciated your input.

[vaioman]

bump.....

[hvacbear]

thanks hvacbear.....

waiting for my 2books

another question, theres a lot of system that can used in cooling any area/space (using chilled water system, condense water system, split type, combination of chilled/condense water, etc)....

how about in heating a building or commercial area, what are the heating system source NORMALLY use base on reliability and low in cost?

PS. i guess in apartments or house its not too complicated to select a system.....furnace+baseboard or radiant heat or package AC unit (?)

thanks and appreciated your input.

There are several types of heating equipment available.

For residential the most common are electric heat, heat pumps (reverse cycle A/C), gas furnace, oil furnace and residential boilers.

Commercially there are all of the above plus larger boilers and furnaces. A lot of larger buildings have hot water systems, but there are lots of new developments in heat pumps and other high efficiency systems. Steam is also common depending on where you are.

[vaioman]

There are several types of heating equipment available.

For residential the most common are electric heat, heat pumps (reverse cycle A/C), gas furnace, oil furnace and residential boilers.

Commercially there are all of the above plus larger boilers and furnaces. A lot of larger buildings have hot water systems, but there are lots of new developments in heat pumps and other high efficiency systems. Steam is also common depending on where you are.

thanks hvacbear. the book you advise is very helpful....anyway i have few question after reading it.

for building (offices), is this the common system they use?..... Boiler (hot water generator) + chiller (aircooled or watercooled?) + 2pumps (1for hotwater & the other one is for chiller) + terminal unit (either AHU, baseboard, etc etc)

for heating terminal unit use in offices (NY), what are commonly use? ducted type for cooling and for heating?, individual Package unit (includes cooling and heating),.....