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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Boston
    Posts
    46

    Seniority question (Union)

    I have a question about seniority at a union job.

    In a nutshell,

    A hack that works in my building got suspended for 1 month (he was leaving work to do personal things while punched in)
    everyone including management knows that he's useless and does nothing all day.

    Management decided to change every ones hours, they say it was to prevent them having to pay out O.T. but we all think it was their way to punish everyone for this guys actions. Well this guy doesn't want to work his new shift hours because it will add 2 hrs commute time each day (rush hour traffic)

    My hours did not change because we have 24-7 coverage for operating the plant.
    I work mostly graveyard shift.

    Another tech works M-F graveyard shift, me and him get along great.

    The hack has now stated that he wants to bid for the M-F graveyard shift, which would bump the other guy who works with me. The other guy has already stated that he will quit if he loses that shift (he does tons of work on the side during the day).
    Management asked me if I wanted to take the "hack's" shift,and the other guy could stay nights working my current shift, I told them "no" because I just bought a house and it would be a huge pay cut (I'd lose my house) They would never let the hack do my job because he doesn't even know what a chiller is.

    Some of the guys I work with are spreading rumors galore, one of them told me that the other guy could take my shift if management wants him to, and I'd have to take the "hacks" shift.

    The hack started 6 mos before me and the other guy.
    Me and the other guy started the exact same day,
    here's my question.
    I was in on the first day, I started and met the shop steward, punched in, met human resources etc. a good hour before he even showed up on the first day.
    Does this mean I could have seniority over him?
    My friend who works at Verizon told me that I absolutely have seniority over him and that's common knowledge in the union that he belongs to.

    Also, by law does my employer have to keep the records of time cards if I have to prove this?
    Local 3 - Firemen and Oilers

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    68,174
    Talk to your shop steward.
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    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    South Jersey
    Posts
    1,461
    Quote Originally Posted by beenthere View Post
    Talk to your shop steward.
    Ditto.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Eastern PA
    Posts
    68,950
    What a soap opera. What ever happened to having the best person suited for the job, do the job? Just because someone has senoirity, he can take over a job a more qualified person is already doing?
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    San Jose, Ca
    Posts
    2,089
    Quote Originally Posted by toolzeppelin View Post
    I have a question about seniority at a union job.

    In a nutshell,

    A hack that works in my building got suspended for 1 month (he was leaving work to do personal things while punched in)
    everyone including management knows that he's useless and does nothing all day.

    Management decided to change every ones hours, they say it was to prevent them having to pay out O.T. but we all think it was their way to punish everyone for this guys actions. Well this guy doesn't want to work his new shift hours because it will add 2 hrs commute time each day (rush hour traffic)


    To start sounds like you should check to see if there are other jobs out there. I would not want to work for this kind of employeer. From what you are saying they should have fired this employee. they did not do their job now they are punishing everyone.




    My hours did not change because we have 24-7 coverage for operating the plant.
    I work mostly graveyard shift.

    Your hours did not change so it is not a new shift? Did your partners shift change?



    The hack has now stated that he wants to bid for the M-F graveyard shift, which would bump the other guy who works with me.


    How can he bid on a job that is not open.


    would never let the hack do my job because he doesn't even know what a chiller is.

    Again management is not doing its job. If he can not do the job why have they not taken care of the problem?



    Also, by law does my employer have to keep the records of time cards if I have to prove this?
    Yes if they are paying by time cards and requireing you to pumch in and out they are required to keep them.


    All the shifts that were changed could be defined as new positions and subject to the bid process.

    You should have a copy of your contract read it. Talk to both your shop steward and business agent. for get the rumors. And if they change your shift and you are not happy file a greavance.
    Old snipes don't die they just loose their steam

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Vancouver, U.S.A.
    Posts
    476
    years ago when i was 15-16 i worked at McDonald's. the management and shift supervisors always said put your ace's in there places. if this guys a hack he should feel lucky he has a job. you two guys deserve to have the shift you both have. if management doesnt see that they need to wake up and smell whats going on.
    Air conditioning to all and to all a good night

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Southold.calm
    Posts
    5,752
    Quote Originally Posted by toolzeppelin View Post
    Does this mean I could have seniority over him?
    YES


    by law does my employer have to keep the records of time cards if I have to prove this?
    YES

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    68,174
    So you have seniority over the other guy on graveyard shift. he goes to second or what ever. Then he quits. Then they need someone to replace him, and a guy with more seniority then you says transfer me to graveyard, and you to that other shift. Your still screwed.
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  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    7,326
    so, do you really think they will let him alone on third shift after he was caught cheating them on first shift? get a clue. do your job and forget about all the rumours.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Boston
    Posts
    46
    Quote Originally Posted by flange View Post
    so, do you really think they will let him alone on third shift after he was caught cheating them on first shift? get a clue. do your job and forget about all the rumours.
    That's the thing, he's politically connected (the hack, hence "HACK"). They don't care if he does nothing, they will not let him run the building, he won't take my job.

    I'm afraid that the other guy (who grew up and is friends with my boss) will be favored and allow him to take my position, which he is totally capable of doing doing my job.

    I'm wondering if I have seniority over him because I started an hour before him on the first day, his employee time card # is also after mine in numeric order because I had punched in and got my time clock set up before him (we use a "hand reader" time clock)

    Do I have an argument?
    Local 3 - Firemen and Oilers

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Boston
    Posts
    46
    Quote Originally Posted by pecmsg View Post
    YES




    YES
    I hope you're right

    I missed your post, I typed the post above before I read yours

    thanks for the response
    Local 3 - Firemen and Oilers

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Southold.calm
    Posts
    5,752
    Quote Originally Posted by toolzeppelin View Post
    That's the thing, he's politically connected (the hack, hence "HACK"). I'm wondering if I have seniority over him because I started an hour before him on the first day, his employee time card # is also after mine in numeric order because I had punched in and got my time clock set up before him (we use a "hand reader" time clock)

    Do I have an argument?
    Once again

    YES

    One Minute, Hour, or Day it means the same thing. All things equal you have seniority.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    9,548
    You have an employee number or "clock" number? That's what determines your seniority. The secretary handed a guy his time card at the same time as myself, but she assigned him one clock number lower, guess who had the seniority?
    If everything was always done "by the book"....the book would never change.

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