R410--vs--r22

[Reudly1234]

This is my first time in this forum and I find it very entertaining. I may not be right but at least I'm not rude.

[4l530]

Glad you're enjoying it.
It's way more fun when you don't take it too seriously.

[aruddick]

Who is being rude? all you can see is words and 85% of communication is non-verbal

[Reudly1234]

I wont take it to seriously. It's all good. Like I said, we cant be all that smart, you get a big piece of flat metal, cut it up, fold it into a can, stick your head in it and beat on it with a hammer! We cant be to smart, my ears still ring just thinking about it.

[Reudly1234]

http://peakenergy.net/envirosafe.htm

Envirosafe Benefits

* Non-Toxic
Environmentally Safe
* 33% More Efficient
* No License Necessary
* No Recycling
* No Retrofitting
Fully compatible as a direct drop in replacement with either R-12 Freon or R-134a systems.
* Does not require a compressor oil change.
* Guaranteed not to harm air conditioning system components or any related mechanical equipment if installed and used according to factory directions.
* Does not become caustic if contaminated with moisture and oxygen.



* Is a better conductor of heat and requires less horsepower to compress, which reduces compressor wear and extends compressor life.
* Ignition temperature is 1585ºF at both 5 PSI and 0 PSI, is markedly better than R-134a's ignition temperature of 368ºF at 5 PSI and 1411ºF at 0 PSI.
* Hydrocarbon refrigerant endorsed by Greenpeace in full compliance with the UN Montreal Protocol.
* No harm to the ozone layer. (Obviously)
* EnviroSafe even costs less than R-134.

[Reudly1234]

ENVIRO-SAFE

Material Safety Data Sheet

IDENTITY

ENVIRO-SAFE


Proper Shipping Name: Petroleum Gases Liquefied
UN Number: UN1075
Hazard Class/Division: 2.1
Uses: Refrigeration gases

Section 1: IDENTIFICATION
Manufacturer's Name:
Enviro-Safe Refrigerants, Inc.

Date Prepared: February 1, 1997

Section 2: PHYSICAL DESCRIPTION AND/OR PROPERTIES
Appearance/Odor: Clear; Colorless; odor added
Odor Threshold: None available
Coeff. Water/Oil Dist.: <1
Freezing Point: -267ºF
Vapor Density: (est.) 1.76
Vapor Pressure: (PSIG) 70 @ 70°F Physical State: Gas
Specific Gravity: 0.540
Evaporation Rate: Rapid
Boiling Point: -30.4°F
pH: N/A

Section 3: FIRE OR EXPLOSION HAZARD
Auto Ignition Temperature: 1585°F
Flashpoint: Not Available Lower Flammable Limit (LEL): 1.9%
Upper Flammable Limit (UEL): 8.5%
Extinguishing Media: If possible, stop the flow of gas. Use water to cool fire exposed tanks, surroundings and to protect personnel working on shut off. Water spray, dry powder, or carbon dioxide can be directed at flame area to reduce fire intensity. Do not extinguish flames unless leak can be stopped.
Hazardous Combustion Products: Normal combustion forms carbon monoxide.
Sensitivity to Static Discharge: Vapor may ignite if exposed to static discharge.
Explosion Data: Sensitivity to impact. Mixture is not sensitive.
Fire and Explosion Hazard: Flammable vapors may form if allowed to mix with air. Accumulation of gas is an ignition hazard. Vapors are heavier than air and may travel to an ignition source.

[4l530]

Sounds like propane.

I'd be very afraid of leaky evaporator coils in residential applications

[Reudly1234]

FLASH POINT:
-156"
F (-lM" C)
AUTOIGNITION: 842'F (432" C)
IGNITION TEMPERATURE IN AIR: 920- 1120" F
FLAMMABLB LIMITS IN AIR BY VOLUME: Lower:2.15o/o
lJpper:9.67o
EXTINGUISIIING MEDIA: Dry chemical. CO2, water spray or fog tor surrounding area. Do not cxtinguish t'irc until
propane source is shut ofT.
SPECIAL FIRE-FIGHTING INSTRUCTIONS: B,vacuate pcnonnel from danger iuea- Immediately cool container with
water spray from maximum distance, taking care not to extinguish flames. If flames are accidentally extinguished, expltlsivc
re-ignition may occur. Where water is abundant and immediate, tie hrc should be allowed to burn while the container and area
are cooled and the flow of propane is shut off. Where water is scarce, compare tie risk of allowing the area to continue to heat
from the lre and the alternative of extinguishing the fire without shutting off the propine flow, which may allow fbr the
propane to accumulate and re-ignite explosively.
UNUSUAL FIRE AND EXPLOSION HAZARDS: Propane is easily ignited. It is heavier than air; theretbre, it can collect in
low areas where an ignition source can be present. Pressure in a container can build up due to heat and container may rupture
if pressure relief devices should fail to function. Propane released tiom a properly functioning relief valve on an overheated
container can also become ignited.
HAZARDOUS COMBUSTION PRODUCTS: None.

[drumstorm]

Well, I was leaning towards purchasing a central a/c unit with R-22 only but....after checking out this cool site and reading more about R-410A from the Honeywell & Copeland websites, I'm not sure now.

[Reudly1234]

I have installed lots of 410a systems with my company well and very smooth. The high end units are very quite. When comparing systems if you are using a heat pump pay attention to the HSPF this is the Heating Seasonal performance factor. "This is the heating side of the system." A little bit of a change in this number is a big change. The higher the number the better. When checking the sound of the unit you need to check the bell rating, again a little bit of a change in that number means a lot. The lower the bell rating the better. On a air conditioner you need to compare the SEER rating. Seasonal energy efficiency ratio. This would also be the cooling side of a Heat Pump rating.

In Arizona or some place like that you want to use a very high seer rating due the the large amount of cooling required. This keeps the cooling bills low. In Washington State you want to have a very high HSPF because it is a heating dominated climate. Although both sides are best either way yet when money is a factor than you want to choose where to cut the costs.

[beenthere]

To the OP.

You want all your systems to match.
As teh other 2 systems nneed replaced. You'll be replacing them with R410A units, so they will match eventually.

R22 is getting expensive. R410A won't get any cheaper after 2010 either. As demand for it goes up, so will its price.
Those so called drop ins. If anyone of them catches on, and demand for it goes up, so will its price. JMO.

Your in a no win situation as far as which gas to use. Neither choice will be right, or wrong.

[KTM-MIKE]

Wow thank you all for your comments and information!