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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Oklahoma
    Posts
    58

    Evacuation and 410a.

    As you are already experiencing pains and joy of transiton from R22 to 410a. My question is, what is the evacuation level you must achieve when working with 410a? I have heard different stories from different people. I aim to achiev at least 1000 microns and not to have a rise of more than 300 microns when replacing a major component for R22. in an old system. R410 and POE oils are more sensitive to moisture and I have not done very many 410a system installs yet. What is your take on the evacuation levels when you install or replace major component in a system with 410a? Is 1000 micron sufficient? Is there an industry standard for evacuation?
    I would appriciate all the help and comments.
    Thanks
    HS
    HS

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    burlington county n.j.
    Posts
    9,728
    at least 500 and hold it. our average install timing usually ends up with a 200-250 micron reading, just for coil and lines.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Fayetteville,Arkansas
    Posts
    1,427
    500 microns on a new clean system. Open a R410-a system up for component replacement and you'll need 250 microns to remove moisture from the POE oil.
    If you choose not to decide you still have made a choice.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    67,880
    Quote Originally Posted by hvaclogic View Post
    500 microns on a new clean system. Open a R410-a system up for component replacement and you'll need 250 microns to remove moisture from the POE oil.
    At 250 microns, you still won't get the moisture out of the poe oil.
    The filter drier will have to remove the rest.


    To the OP.
    500 microns for R410A, and for R22.
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  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    surban detroit, mi
    Posts
    15
    also purge the evacuated system with nitrogen, pump down to 500 microns, and in my class it was stressed to repeat the procedure 3 times

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    surban detroit, mi
    Posts
    15
    just took a class in r-417a. dupont has had this freon on the market since '97. it's a drop in replacement for r-22 and not subject to the montreal protocols. same charging requirements as r-22 as well.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN, USA
    Posts
    34,060
    As I recall, that's ICOR's NU22, predecessor to NU22b which has less capacity loss. Not a drop in, gotta take the 22 out first. Otherwise works like 22. Said to have 5-15% capacity loss. ICOR is now pushing NU22b which I seem to think is R422b. Not sure if Dupont has it or not.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    67,880
    Plus you use bubble and dew point for charging.
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  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    6,285
    Quote Originally Posted by heatplanman View Post
    just took a class in r-417a. dupont has had this freon on the market since '97. it's a drop in replacement for r-22 and not subject to the montreal protocols. same charging requirements as r-22 as well.
    Did they say anything about 422D?

    On their website it states it can be used in residential and commercial A/C but also states it is used for medium temp.
    http://www.refrigerants.dupont.com/S...pdf/k10930.pdf

    Then for 417A it states basically the same thing.
    http://www.refrigerants.dupont.com/S...pdf/k10932.pdf

    They even have a if your customer ask for this guide them to this .pdf.....
    http://refrigerants.dupont.com/Suva/...pdf/k15293.pdf



    Just seems confusing because Copeland states it voids all warranties and does not recommend it in their compressors. Even though they have a retro guide for them.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    67,880
    I think they made that guide because they know people won't pay attention to the "voids warranty disclaimers".
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  11. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    2,875
    Took a 410a class two weeks ago...was told to pull vac down to 400 microns and ALWAYS use the triple evac. Break with a pound or two of nitrogen between each one....if your micron gauge doesn't rise above 800 after the final evac...you are good to go.
    I need a new signature.....

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    67,880
    LOL..
    I have one of the Acclimate R410A training books in with me.
    It says 500 microns. Or less.

    So it may be just a personal opinion of the guy giving the class, if it should be 500, or 400, or 250.
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  13. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    2,875
    Yeah...this was the class I was in...a few weeks earlier I was hearing of a class that was telling everyone 500 and just one vac. I think out of everything I have heard so far the only things everyone seems to agree on are less than 500 microns, and you should use a vacum pump...LOL
    I need a new signature.....

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