Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 13 of 16
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    5

    Advice on new construction please

    Hello all,

    I am building a house in Charleston SC and have received the following info from our builder on options. Our house is 4000sq feet with a FROG. I was hoping to get some insight on which might be the more reasonable option and whether the dehumidifier and air filtration are things worth adding on. Budget wise the 14 and 16 seer systems are more than we have alotted in our building budget but if the long term cost savings is significant than I don't have a big problem with springing for these. At any rate, this is a bit overwhelming and if any can provide some advice I would really appreciate it!

    OPTIONS:

    4 ton 13 Seer Gas Pack system 1st floor & Frog w/2 zoned systems, 2.5 ton 13 seer Split Heat Pump for second floor.

    3 ton 13 Seer Gas Pack system 1st floor, 2.5 ton 13 Seer Split Heat Pump second floor, 1.5 ton Split Heat Pump FROG.

    3 ton 14 Seer Gas Pack system 1st flr, 2.5 ton 14 Seer Split Heat Pump 2nd flr,1.5 ton Split Heat Pump FROG

    3 ton 16 Seer Gas Pack 1st floor, 2 ton 16 Seer Split Heat Pump 2nd floor, 2 ton 16 Seer Split Heat Pump FROG (10yr. parts and labor warranty) (30% more efficient than 13 Seer) (all units will have 2 stage compressor and variable speed blowers, 90% of the time 1st stage will be engaged and when demand is high 2nd stage kick’s in)

    Add Options

    a. Whole home dehumidifier (designed to allow only the required air changes per hour while managing the humidity in the home. This system will maintain 45% to 50% humidity level preventing the possibility of a mold situation)

    b. Air filtration system (cleans air to 99.97% at .03 microns bacteria stage)

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX
    Posts
    11,087
    Umm...other than an all caps spelling of an amphibian, what is a FROG?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    5
    that was good....sorry it is a Finished Room Over the Garage...

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    The South
    Posts
    1,976
    changey

    Is there a reason for the gaspacks as opposed to split systems?

    td

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    5
    not that I know of, these were the options that our builder and HVAC folks discussed....

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX
    Posts
    11,087
    Was there a heat load calculation performed for this house so the properly sized equipment can be selected for each floor?

    What is your climate like....hot/humid, cold, hot/arid, etc?

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    North Texas
    Posts
    177
    Speaking from my own experiences I would make sure that they install metal duct where there is restricted or no access (where the ducts may run between floors). My house does not have this and alot that I work in do not. Makes for a bad time if flex is installed and has to be replaced due to getting a hole in it (careless duct cleaning, rodents)

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Madison, WI/Cape Coral, FL
    Posts
    6,068
    Quote Originally Posted by changey View Post
    Hello all,

    I am building a house in Charleston SC and have received the following info from our builder on options. Our house is 4000sq feet with a FROG. I was hoping to get some insight on which might be the more reasonable option and whether the dehumidifier and air filtration are things worth adding on. Budget wise the 14 and 16 seer systems are more than we have alotted in our building budget but if the long term cost savings is significant than I don't have a big problem with springing for these. At any rate, this is a bit overwhelming and if any can provide some advice I would really appreciate it!

    OPTIONS:

    4 ton 13 Seer Gas Pack system 1st floor & Frog w/2 zoned systems, 2.5 ton 13 seer Split Heat Pump for second floor.

    3 ton 13 Seer Gas Pack system 1st floor, 2.5 ton 13 Seer Split Heat Pump second floor, 1.5 ton Split Heat Pump FROG.

    3 ton 14 Seer Gas Pack system 1st flr, 2.5 ton 14 Seer Split Heat Pump 2nd flr,1.5 ton Split Heat Pump FROG

    3 ton 16 Seer Gas Pack 1st floor, 2 ton 16 Seer Split Heat Pump 2nd floor, 2 ton 16 Seer Split Heat Pump FROG (10yr. parts and labor warranty) (30% more efficient than 13 Seer) (all units will have 2 stage compressor and variable speed blowers, 90% of the time 1st stage will be engaged and when demand is high 2nd stage kick’s in)

    Add Options

    a. Whole home dehumidifier (designed to allow only the required air changes per hour while managing the humidity in the home. This system will maintain 45% to 50% humidity level preventing the possibility of a mold situation)

    b. Air filtration system (cleans air to 99.97% at .03 microns bacteria stage)
    I am impressed that an a/c contractor suggested a ventilating dehumidifier. I consider it the most important option on the list. I would forgo the high efficiency a/c for fresh air and humidity control during low/no a/c load conditions. The Ultra-Aire Xt150 H removes 7.9 lbs of moisture per KW which the most efficeint dehu in the world. 7.8 Amps, 120 volts- 6lbs./hour. Forgive me for being so biased, we just introduced the UA xt150H- revision 4.0 (the results of 15 years of development).
    A merv 11 air filtering system on all of your air handlers is must. Regards from a proud dad- TB
    Bear Rules: Keep our home <50% RH summer, controls mites/mold and very comfortable.
    Provide 60-100 cfm of fresh air when occupied to purge indoor pollutants and keep window dry during cold weather. T-stat setup/setback +8 hrs. saves energy
    Use +Merv 10 air filter. -Don't forget the "Golden Rule"

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    5
    thanks so much for all of your replies...

    From Shophound:

    Was there a heat load calculation performed for this house so the properly sized equipment can be selected for each floor?

    Yes, this was done

    What is your climate like....hot/humid, cold, hot/arid, etc?

    WE have a hot/humid climate (terrible in June/July/August) with very mild winter. About 4 weeks of very cold weather split between late Jan and Feb. The rest of the year is pretty nice

    Thanks again for all the replies and input!

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    SC
    Posts
    929
    EXTREME heat/humidity in Charleston! Humidity control a MUST.
    I'd suggest you look into a mini-split for the FROG.
    Separate systems for the ground and upper floor cost more initially, but typically provide greater comfort. It's hard to get around that "heat rises" thing. Also, think about what happens when the compressor craps out on a 105 degree day. Wouldn't it be nice to still have a/c in the other half of your house?
    If you are planning to stay in this house many years, go for a quality system. You won't regret it.
    The equipment is only part of the system, the ductwork is just as important.
    Whole house filter is worth the extra $$. I try to put one in on every job now.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    1,253
    Sounds like your are building a nice home and the comfort system you choose is going to be a big part of that.

    Inverter technology has been in use in other parts of the world for years and has been refined to the point that it is currently the top of the heap for comfort systems. Currently, only one U.S. manufacturer, Nordyne, has moved in that direction, but there are many other companies to choose from. Daikin VRV-S, Mitsubishi City Multi, Sanyo Eco-i Mini, all make fully variable inverter driven multi-zoned units that are extremely quiet, very efficient, and provide unmatched comfort.

    These manufacturers are often thought of as being makers of mini-splits, but these are NOT mini-splits, rather full split systems. These are smaller versions of large commercial systems that are focused on the residential and light commercial market. They are often referred to as VRV or VRF systems.

    These are fully inverter driven systems that have a single outdoor unit that can have up to eight or nine indoor units connected. The air handlers are small allowing them to fit in tighter spaces (they also have ductless indoor units) to create zones as needed. Since each air handler would have its own ducting this eliminates the need for specialty designed and installed elaborate over sized zoning duct work to handle multi zones with dump zones and the like. With the typical zone systems you would still be running a large compressor even when a small zone was the only one calling. With these systems the compressor slows down in speed to meet the load and can run as low as 25% of the rated capacity. The indoor units also modulate to meet the load. Almost constant running of the compressor is how they handle humidity better than most if not all other systems.

    Most of the manufacturers have many different types of indoor units (Sanyo, for example, has six different types of indoor units both ducted and ductless with seven different capacity ratings starting as low as 7,500 BTU and going up to a 4 tons) that can be connected to the outdoor unit.

    Capacity range is three to five tons with heating capacities that can not be matched by any typical US system. Can't really oversize them as the compressor slows down to meet the load.

    For your home, if the load calc is correct, you may need a 4 ton and a 3 ton outdoor unit which will give you up to 14 indoor units/zones. Your design engineer may be able to drop the total outdoor unit size smaller because of the efficiency in which these systems handle the cooling and heating diversity within the home.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    66,818
    3 ton 14 Seer Gas Pack system 1st flr, 2.5 ton 14 Seer Split Heat Pump 2nd flr,1.5 ton Split Heat Pump FROG

    This one, because the quote for the 16 SEER is dropping you to 2 ton, when everyone else went 2.5 ton for the second floor. (makes it a bad WAG on my part)

    The whole house dehumidifier is an excellent option.
    The cleaner/purifiers only help your house if you run the fan 24/7.
    If you have ductwork in the attic, 24/7 fan operation isn't the best thing to do.

    Just my dog gone 2 red cents.
    Contractor locator map

    How-to-apply-for-Professional

    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    468

    pull the attic into the conditioned envelope...

    ...using sprayfoam insulation under the roof sheathing. Don't vent the attic. The ducts and HVAC equipment can be placed there without an efficiency / thermal penalty

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Comfortech Show Promo Image

Related Forums

Plumbing Talks | Contractor Magazine
Forums | Electrical Construction & Maintenance (EC&M) Magazine
Comfortech365 Virtual Event