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  1. #235
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX
    Posts
    11,300
    Quote Originally Posted by Carnak View Post
    I plagerized your constant battle with pink patches this morning on an investigation.
    Glad my were actually helpful.
    • Electricity makes refrigeration happen.
    • Refrigeration makes the HVAC psychrometric process happen.
    • HVAC pyschrometrics is what makes indoor human comfort happen...IF the ducts AND the building envelope cooperate.


    A building is NOT beautiful unless it is also comfortable.

  2. #236
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    11,808
    I was there after the fact, this was a cathedral ceiling problem, and the panelling board on the ceiling was stopping water

    So I asked them if they saw any purple-pink splotches when they were gutting it, they went on about seeing it at the seams of the panelling, so then I went into teddy mode and spun the yarn about classic symptoms and guys in hotels constantly repairing vinyl wall paper.

    Got a good theory on radiant barriers out of this one as well.
    The way we build has a greater impact on our comfort, energy consumption and IAQ than any HVAC system we install.

    http://www.ductstrap.com/

  3. #237
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    south louisiana
    Posts
    3,139
    I have a friend who works in the glass industry.
    He called me a few weeks ago while replacing the
    floor to ceiling mirrors in the master bath of a home
    his company works for.
    when he removed the discolored mirror section to change it out
    guess what he found on the back of the mirror?
    a layer of black mold on sheetrock and back of mirror
    it had penetrated the backing of the mirror and the mirror
    was discolored.
    another dumb thing to do in the south...
    install a vapor barrier in the most moisture laden room of the house.
    mold will continue to grow in these areas, until someone
    tells the homeowner why the mirrors are losing their reflectivity.
    then bathroom re-model is in order after re-mediation of mold.
    It isn't going to be the glass company that tells them what the real problem is.
    I don't know the homeowners..just the situation.
    As the glass company changes those mirrors every year, I guess it
    isn't in their best money making interest to tell them why.
    My friend called because he wanted to know..I doubt the homeowner
    has any idea. (personally...that bothers me.
    The cure of the part should not be attempted without the cure of the whole. ~Plato

  4. #238
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX
    Posts
    11,300
    _la,

    I take it these full length mirrors were in the bath on the inside of an exterior wall?

    I can't blame you for what you said being bothersome. It bothers me that the most frequent response to such problems is to attack the symptom but not provide the cure. Kind of like a good portion of "health care", but I won't go there (this isn't ARP! ). It's similar to blaming "sick building syndrome" sheerly on the house being tight, when the actual culprits are VOC's of construction materials and personal items used in the home, along with inadequate fresh air exchange.

    Sure, the glass company makes some nice coin annually for the mirror swap-out, but the homeowner faces a yearly shell out of cash, and the damaged mirror ends up in the landfill, when it could've enjoyed a much longer life had some intelligent sleuthing gone on toward fixing the problem. This doesn't touch the health issues allowing mold to grow unchecked for a year behind a mirror might present to the occupants. Can we say "perpetuation of inanity?"
    • Electricity makes refrigeration happen.
    • Refrigeration makes the HVAC psychrometric process happen.
    • HVAC pyschrometrics is what makes indoor human comfort happen...IF the ducts AND the building envelope cooperate.


    A building is NOT beautiful unless it is also comfortable.

  5. #239
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    11,808
    mirrors,wall mounted pictures and furniture up against exterior walls

    start looking at pdf page 12 or book page 110

    http://www.masongrant.com/pdf_2008/A...DG_C7_Mold.pdf

    Another one is class room black boards

    read what they say about curtains, I see this happen on furniture away from the walls when cheap people with leaky homes shut off the AC all day and then crank it at night
    The way we build has a greater impact on our comfort, energy consumption and IAQ than any HVAC system we install.

    http://www.ductstrap.com/

  6. #240
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    south louisiana
    Posts
    3,139
    Shophound...the mirrors are on interior and exterior walls...
    reckon these folks like to look at themselves from all angles.

    I think we can say ""perpetuation of inanity?"
    but maybe it should be said as perpetuation of insanity.....???

    and there was a time (in my 20's) that I thought cutting off the
    a/c was a good idea...as I rented in New Orleans, for a premium price.
    at the time I didn't know anything about insulation...there was none..
    or house leakage.
    guess I'm still living and learning..who would have thought! LOL!
    Hope you all have a most excellent holiday weekend.
    The cure of the part should not be attempted without the cure of the whole. ~Plato

  7. #241
    I have about 2000 square feet of attic space. There are 4 hip roofs that join in the center of the house with only about 8' of ridge vent. We have no soffit vents. The south side of the house is exposed to sunlight all day during the summer and the second floor of the house is very warm (2 AC units runs constantly). Will installing soffit vents alone provide sufficient attic ventilation or could I be a candidate for an attic fan?

  8. #242
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Myrtle Beach, SC
    Posts
    2,919
    Quote Originally Posted by jtgv View Post
    I have about 2000 square feet of attic space. There are 4 hip roofs that join in the center of the house with only about 8' of ridge vent. We have no soffit vents. The south side of the house is exposed to sunlight all day during the summer and the second floor of the house is very warm (2 AC units runs constantly). Will installing soffit vents alone provide sufficient attic ventilation or could I be a candidate for an attic fan?
    I can't say. It depends on;

    Where you are and your climate

    What color shingles

    How high your attic is

    how good your ridge vents are

    how much soffit vent you add and the net free area of the opening (screens and louvers reduce the effective opening area)

    etc etc etc

    Generally, powered vents add more problems than they solve.

    Get wind turbines and soffit and ridge vents first

    Better ceiling insulation on the second floor will help more than vent fans. So will better windows. and once installed, windows & insulation use no electricity.
    Last edited by Kevin O'Neill; 03-11-2010 at 10:21 AM. Reason: addition
    Remember, Air Conditioning begins with AIR.

  9. #243
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    4H: Hot, Humid Houston H.O.
    Posts
    3,304
    Quote Originally Posted by jtgv View Post
    I have about 2000 square feet of attic space. There are 4 hip roofs that join in the center of the house with only about 8' of ridge vent. We have no soffit vents. The south side of the house is exposed to sunlight all day during the summer and the second floor of the house is very warm (2 AC units runs constantly). Will installing soffit vents alone provide sufficient attic ventilation or could I be a candidate for an attic fan?
    While your hip roof prevents you from some solutions, you have more than just those two choices. For one thing, static "air hawk" vents can be placed near the peak of your roof. Almost every thing I hear, informs me that a power attic fan will consume more energy to run, than it can ever save on your AC.

    You say your 2nd floor gets very warm, but we could stand to hear more about your problem description. The fact 2 AC units run constantly may not signal a problem, if indeed they cannot satisfy your thermostat setpoint then certainly that IS a problem. What temperature are you aiming for, and can you achieve that?

    It never hurts to say what location you are in. I am a homeowner in S.Texas for example. In my state ductwork is commonly located in an unconditioned attic, and leakage presents dual problems: 1) often 10% of the conditioned air never gets into the house, and 2) that same volume must be made up by infiltration (or rarely, other means). But I don't know anything about your house, nor do any of the great professionals who might offer advice.

    Best of luck -- Pstu

    P.S. You might get better answers if you repeat your original question, starting a new thread all your own. This one has over 200 posts and to some people represents a tired discussion. Few threads grow to this length, and they become unwieldy.

  10. #244
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX
    Posts
    11,300
    Quote Originally Posted by jtgv View Post
    I have about 2000 square feet of attic space. There are 4 hip roofs that join in the center of the house with only about 8' of ridge vent. We have no soffit vents. The south side of the house is exposed to sunlight all day during the summer and the second floor of the house is very warm (2 AC units runs constantly). Will installing soffit vents alone provide sufficient attic ventilation or could I be a candidate for an attic fan?
    Soffit vents can certainly help get more air into the attic, but for whatever amount of soffit venting is added, there should be just as much if not more amount of venting up high to exhaust the air the soffit vents intake. There is more than one way to naturally ventilate a roof if you can't get enough ridge vent installed. A PAV is one option but the caveat is the ceiling below the attic should be airtight to minimize loss of conditioned air from the house when the PAV runs.

    Also, soffit vents are worthless if they become blocked by insulation near the edges of the attic. They must have a clear shot to be effective. Typically a good way to assure this happens is to install baffles against the rafters so no insulation can block the soffit opening.
    • Electricity makes refrigeration happen.
    • Refrigeration makes the HVAC psychrometric process happen.
    • HVAC pyschrometrics is what makes indoor human comfort happen...IF the ducts AND the building envelope cooperate.


    A building is NOT beautiful unless it is also comfortable.

  11. #245

    Do power attic fans help

    Thanks for the quick responses to my original post. Some additional information based on your replies: We live in NJ and we don't have any ductwork running through the attic. There is about 8 inches of insulation on the attic floor. At the center point, the attic ceiling is a good 7-8' high (more than enough room to stand up and move around). As far as the AC temperature, we generally try to keep it around 75-77 degrees and the first floor seems to cool much better than the second (could there be an issue with the speed/power of the AC fan, as we don't have issues in the winter with heating the 2nd floor?)



    I have about 2000 square feet of attic space. There are 4 hip roofs that join in the center of the house with only about 8' of ridge vent. We have no soffit vents. The south side of the house is exposed to sunlight all day during the summer and the second floor of the house is very warm (2 AC units runs constantly). Will installing soffit vents alone provide sufficient attic ventilation or could I be a candidate for an attic fan?

  12. #246
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    The Beach
    Posts
    688
    You have been given some good information, make your choise and let us know how it worked. If possible add as much ridge vent as possible. You will need some place for the air to get into the attic. Soffit or boxing vents, No roof fans. The air will just short cycle.
    Add another 12" of blown insulation in the attic. Check all ceiling penatrations and seal.
    Could have a pro. check the speed of the second floor AC and see if the fan speed could be increased for AC.
    Blue Fox

  13. #247

    Large Round Exhasut Vents For The Attic

    Hi. I found a lot of useful information on this thread concerning attic ventilation. There does seem to be a lot of agreement that passive ventilation (along with efforts at radiant barriers, insulation, etc.) is preferable to powered attic ventilation. I am now in the process of removing my attic fan (because it broke), and I am considering putting in passive exhaust venting near the peak of my roof.

    My attic floor is 1050 sq. ft. and I have a hip roof at a 4:12 pitch. There are abundant soffit vents, so my intake is good. But the ridge line is extremely short, so a ridge vent is not an option for me.

    I have looked at some attic vent manufacturer websites and I see that there in addition to small rectangular exhaust vents with 50 square inches of net free area, there are large round exhaust vents that are commercially available with 144 square inches of net free area (I found them on the Air Vent Inc website and the Ventamatic website). Having a large round exhaust vent is appealing to me because I think it will look better on my roof than numerous small roof vents would look (these small ones would need to be bunched close together near the center peak of my roof). Also, since I am removing a fan, I already have a round hole cut in my roof, so the swap (round vent for fan) should be more straightforward of a job for me.

    Does anyone know of how these large round vents do as exhaust vents? Do they perform as advertised and produce good exhaust ventilation?

    I probably could use more than 144 square inches of net free area for my exhaust ventilation, but maybe this amount will provide a “near adequate” amount of exhaust for my attic.

    Thanks for any thoughts you might have!
    Bill (in Pennsylvania)

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