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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
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    Eugene, Oregon
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    Robinair digital gauges

    See the ad to your right? I tried to pull up those nifty looking gauges however, I can't seem to find them on their site.
    Proud supporter of Springfield Millers and Oregon Ducks.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Charleston, SC, USA
    Posts
    108
    I am trying to teach my tech how to charge a system, it really is an art form that will be lost but to us old timers when the digital gauges are the norm. With the 410 and other refrigerants coming out the digital charging systems will be the standard way to charge. I am looking for what to get for myself, here are the links.

    http://www.refcoswiss.com/nordamerika/index_e.html

    http://www.yellowjacket.com/HVACRPro...l=5&c=33&p=310

    I think the scales are important unless the digital gauges have a capacity of refrigerant measure
    Be good to your fellow man, not nice. There is a difference.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Eugene, Oregon
    Posts
    1,209
    The ad shows what looks to be replacement gauges that are digital. I've had the full meal deal digital gauges at like $500 bucks plus keys for differant refrigerants, lasted maybe 4 months. I kinda like the replacement style gauges.
    Proud supporter of Springfield Millers and Oregon Ducks.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Charleston, SC, USA
    Posts
    108
    also look at

    DIGIMON - Digital Manifold
    The Two-Way Digital Manifold by refeco
    http://www.refcoswiss.com/nordamerika/index_e.html
    open pdf
    Be good to your fellow man, not nice. There is a difference.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    North Richland Hills, Texas
    Posts
    14,914
    Quote Originally Posted by answer View Post
    I am trying to teach my tech how to charge a system, it really is an art form that will be lost but to us old timers when the digital gauges are the norm.
    They don't tell you anything that analogue gauges and regular thermometers don't.
    They just give you accurate, timely, and repeatable data, you still have to know what to do with it.

    I don't regard refrigerant charging as an "art form", at least not with systems that are factory tested and matched systems, especially not in the residential market.
    It is a science that requires accurate, repeatable information, in real time, to get right.
    It only becomes an "art form" when dealing with mismatched, or incorrectly applied equipment, especially when the airflow is not correct.

    Now there are units like the Service Assistant, and the Stargate 3000, that will calculate target superheat or subcooling, and tell you if the system is correctly charged, but they are more high dollar.
    Trane also has "Charge Assist" built into their new communicating XL19i unit, and will come in future models, that has simi automatic charging built in. The unit tells you to add or remove refrigerant, or if it is correctly charged. It will automatically charge itself if you hook a refrigerant drum up to it through the optional charging solenoid.

    Expect to see more and more equipment manufacturers come out with similar setups, and instrument manufacturers develop more things along the lines of the Service Assistant and Stargate units.

    There have been a lot of studies done to find out what percentage of systems get installed with the incorrect refrigerant charge. They range from a "low" of 53% of new systems being installed with the incorrect refrigerant charge, to a high of 67%.
    It is no surprise that equipment and instrument manufacturers are scrambling to do something about that.
    Last edited by mark beiser; 03-14-2008 at 08:46 PM.
    If more government is the answer, then it's a really stupid question.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Waffleville
    Posts
    10,339
    i ordered my yellow jacket set today!! i am so excited!! i get them on tuesday. i cannot wait!! i'll post back my adventure
    If Guns Kill People, Do Pencils Misspell Words?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=An2a1...eature=related

    Before we work on artificial intelligence why don't we do something about natural stupidity?

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Waffleville
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    10,339
    Quote Originally Posted by mark beiser View Post
    They don't tell you anything that analogue gauges and regular thermometers do.
    They just give you accurate, timely, and repeatable data, you still have to know what to do with it.

    I don't regard refrigerant charging as an "art form", at least not with systems that are factory tested and matched systems, especially not in the residential market.
    It is a science that requires accurate, repeatable information, in real time, to get right.
    It only becomes an "art form" when dealing with mismatched, or incorrectly applied equipment, especially when the airflow is not correct.

    Now there are units like the Service Assistant, and the Stargate 3000, that will calculate target superheat or subcooling, and tell you if you if the system is correctly charged, but they are more high dollar.
    Trane also has "Charge Assist" built into their new communicating XL19i unit, and will come in future models, that has simi automatic charging built in. The unit tells you to add or remove refrigerant, or if it is correctly charged. It will automatically charge itself if you hook a refrigerant drum up to it through the optional charging solenoid.

    Expect to see more and more equipment manufacturers come out with similar setups, and instrument manufacturers develop more things along the lines of the Service Assistant and Stargate units.

    There have been a lot of studies done to find out what percentage of systems get installed with the incorrect refrigerant charge. They range from a "low" of 53% of new systems being installed with the incorrect refrigerant charge, to a high of 67%.
    It is no surprise that equipment and instrument manufacturers are scrambling to do something about that.
    echo
    If Guns Kill People, Do Pencils Misspell Words?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=An2a1...eature=related

    Before we work on artificial intelligence why don't we do something about natural stupidity?

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Waffleville
    Posts
    10,339
    i just figure, how can i tell HO that mecury t-stat is worthless and not accurate. let me go out to your system with my anolog gauges and see whats going on... LMAO really. and everything else we use is difital now. micron gauges. multi meters. you still use analog muti metter?? you are old timer lol
    If Guns Kill People, Do Pencils Misspell Words?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=An2a1...eature=related

    Before we work on artificial intelligence why don't we do something about natural stupidity?

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
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    wedged in freezer shelf
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    6,132
    Quote Originally Posted by answer View Post
    I am looking for what to get for myself, here are the links.

    http://www.yellowjacket.com/HVACRPro...l=5&c=33&p=310
    The ad says "It's strong.... Crushing walnuts with your bare hands strong"
    Crushing walnuts with your bare hands is easy if you know how
    Last edited by itsiceman; 03-14-2008 at 09:17 PM.
    “If You Can Dodge A Wrench You Can Dodge A Ball”

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Ft.Worth,Tx
    Posts
    4,581

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by answer View Post
    I am trying to teach my tech how to charge a system, it really is an art form that will be lost but to us old timers when the digital gauges are the norm. With the 410 and other refrigerants coming out the digital charging systems will be the standard way to charge. I am looking for what to get for myself, here are the links.

    http://www.refcoswiss.com/nordamerika/index_e.html

    http://www.yellowjacket.com/HVACRPro...l=5&c=33&p=310

    I think the scales are important unless the digital gauges have a capacity of refrigerant measure
    I like the Refco digital gauges we got a pair and all the technicians got a week to try them out, only thing is when it's really cold lens fogs a little. Performance and durability I would go with Refco over the Yellow Jacket and also cost. Refco is cheaper and better built..

    Anyway our Boss is springing for us all to have digitals and if he's paying I would not argue.. April we will all have new gauges..
    "Everyday above ground, is a good day".
    "But everyday that you have made a difference in someones life, may insure you stay above ground a little longer".<aircooled>

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    South Jersey
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    1,461
    Quote Originally Posted by aircooled53 View Post
    Performance and durability I would go with Refco over the Yellow Jacket and also cost. Refco is cheaper and better built..
    Why???

  12. #12
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    Aug 2004
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    North Richland Hills, Texas
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    Quote Originally Posted by aircooled53 View Post
    Performance and durability I would go with Refco over the Yellow Jacket and also cost. Refco is cheaper and better built.
    I'm curious how you arrived at the conclusion that the refco has better performance, is more durable, and better built than the Yellow Jacket(Digi-Cool) unit.

    Cheaper, and a neat little package yes, but it is lower accuracy, slower responding, has an inferior display, and is less weather resistant.
    It looks to be a good entry level digital, but is not quite on the same level as the Digi-Cool and Testo units laboratory grade accuracy, proven durability, and really great displays, and it is unproven yet.
    The price point for a unit that includes a built in micron gauge makes me suspicious of the quality of the electronics.
    It is only on my "buy recommendation" list because of Refco's track record for high quality products.
    I also like that the built in manifold includes angled hose keepers like a regular manifold, I just wish they came out the front.
    If purchased from one of our area Trane distributors, it has a 2 year over the counter warranty, so if there do turn out to be issues, at least it has some local warranty support.
    If they turn out to be of reasonable durability, I think Refco may have scored big due to the price point and solid retail distribution of units in stock for immediate purchase.

    The Master Cool gauge set is actually significantly more feature rich, for only a little more, but it is on my "avoid for now" list due to Master Cools track record of cheap junk products, lol.
    If more government is the answer, then it's a really stupid question.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Ft.Worth,Tx
    Posts
    4,581
    Quote Originally Posted by mark beiser View Post
    I'm curious how you arrived at the conclusion that the refco has better performance, is more durable, and better built than the Yellow Jacket(Digi-Cool) unit.

    Cheaper, and a neat little package yes, but it is lower accuracy, slower responding, has an inferior display, and is less weather resistant.
    It looks to be a good entry level digital, but is not quite on the same level as the Digi-Cool and Testo units laboratory grade accuracy, proven durability, and really great displays, and it is unproven yet.
    The price point for a unit that includes a built in micron gauge makes me suspicious of the quality of the electronics.
    It is only on my "buy recommendation" list because of Refco's track record for high quality products.
    I also like that the built in manifold includes angled hose keepers like a regular manifold, I just wish they came out the front.
    If purchased from one of our area Trane distributors, it has a 2 year over the counter warranty, so if there do turn out to be issues, at least it has some local warranty support.
    If they turn out to be of reasonable durability, I think Refco may have scored big due to the price point and solid retail distribution of units in stock for immediate purchase.

    The Master Cool gauge set is actually significantly more feature rich, for only a little more, but it is on my "avoid for now" list due to Master Cools track record of cheap junk products, lol.
    I have talk to other technicians that have used yellow jacket in commerical and refrigeration and they were not impressed with them;now me maybe I should wait and judge it for myself. But, my opinion is not worth much in the digital market as I have never owned digital gauges. Refco does make other products and I have some of them and they hold up to hard wear, in Texas heat.
    "Everyday above ground, is a good day".
    "But everyday that you have made a difference in someones life, may insure you stay above ground a little longer".<aircooled>

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