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  1. #14
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    North Richland Hills, Texas
    Posts
    14,914
    Quote Originally Posted by shophound View Post
    I still have two more float balls in my cooling towers that I need to change out. I'm wondering if I took one, dried it out, spray painted it flat black, drilled out the top where the float rod threads in, and then made a fitting to accept a regular mercury bulb thermometer...how would that work? If it did it could be done on the cheap...sure seems a waste to toss two copper float balls away.
    That is the kind of thing I was thinking about making one out of, but I don't have old ones laying around, so I was going to hit up a plumbing supply for some new ones to cannibalize.
    some high temp mat black paint on the outside should do the trick.

    At the museum I am constantly logging and trending data.Temperature, humidity, dew point, wet bulb, etc. One of the instruments we've used for logging purposes is a system called "Hobo"...it consists of small data loggers than you attach to a laptop to set their parameters, then set in the environment you wish to monitor. The loggers can later be uploaded to the computer, where software is then used to create trend data, etc. Pretty cool stuff.
    DUH!

    I have been using HOBO temp/RH loggers for years. I would like to set it up so I don't have to go into the attic to retrieve data from them though.

    Saw it the other day at the conference. It does look sweet.
    I was driving my old van!
    Or did I show you the proof of the van wrap graphics on my phone?
    If more government is the answer, then it's a really stupid question.

  2. #15
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX
    Posts
    11,281
    Well, I guess it's safe to say you know about HOBO loggers, then. :P

    When I was writing about them last night, the thought crossed my mind if there was anyone out there who made a HOBO type logger that could be accessed remotely. Seems like SOMEBODY would've made that next logical step, already. But who?

    If that was your old van, it still looks good. I've also seen a van belonging to your company at TCC...but I'm not about to strike out twice and say that was your new one.

    If you'd come to the chapter meetings, you could show the new one off to your heart's content.

  3. #16
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Near Chicago, IL
    Posts
    3,317
    Quote Originally Posted by speedymonk View Post
    I've been toying with the idea of installing radiant barrier material on my rafters. Does this actually help reduce heat in the home (by its reflective qualities) or would simply adding more insulation be the better route? Combination? I'm guessing this helps the home envelope and would decrease both heating and cooling bills. I figured you fine professional type folk would know, Twilli in particular.
    I have used Prodex from www.insulation4less.com

    I have it installed in my van on the ceiling and the walls. That has made a huge difference in the summer... bringing the temperature down from unbearable to bearable. The factory AC will also keep it cool.

    I have also put it under the roof deck on the west facing exposure of my garage roof. Again, a noticeable difference.

    Totally unscientific, no dataloggers were used.

    The product seems to work as a radiant barrier, but I have no way to prove their insulating R value claims.

  4. #17
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    North Richland Hills, Texas
    Posts
    14,914
    Quote Originally Posted by shophound View Post
    If that was your old van, it still looks good. I've also seen a van belonging to your company at TCC...but I'm not about to strike out twice and say that was your new one.
    That's my old one. It's a good "20 footer", if you know what I mean.
    The new van just went in to get a wrap this week, should get it back Tuesday.
    If more government is the answer, then it's a really stupid question.

  5. #18
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Dallas (Plano), TX
    Posts
    168
    Quote Originally Posted by shophound View Post
    ... the thought crossed my mind if there was anyone out there who made a HOBO type logger that could be accessed remotely. Seems like SOMEBODY would've made that next logical step, already. But who? ...
    I'm looking around now for a copper ball about 6-9" in diamater that I would then paint flat black.

    My attic at the moment presently doesn't have any RB, has minimal venting, and is one large air volume over a single story 3400 sf residence - ideal to set a base line up for measurement, and then measure actual benefit of improvement.

    I already have a temp sensor in my attic, doing temp logging, that's remotely accessible to anyone (InsideConditions chart at http://www.welserver.com/WEL0043 ). (Product I'm using is available from here: http://www.welserver.com ). So all I've got to do to set up a black ball sensor is find a copper ball, as I've already got the rest of the infrastructure needed for data logging, including internet access, in place.

    Thanks for the ideas here - I've been wondering for a while how to set up a baseline to measure benefit of RB and/or attic ventilation improvement.

    Best regards,

    Bill

  6. #19
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Olympia, Wash.
    Posts
    192
    I appreciate the replies. Have any put barriers under the floor to help stop heat loss. I say this because one fine gentelman from Florida sent me figures showing heat loss of 17.9% comes through the floor. Walls and windows were first. I think he based it on new construction of R-30 or more in the ceiling, showing 7.9% loss through the ceiling.

    Anyone done this?

  7. #20
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX
    Posts
    11,281
    Some anectdotal evidence from yesterday's conditions at my house, with radiant barrier spray-on in place. The outdoor temperature peaked near ninety degrees. The indoor air temperature peaked at 72 degrees. We did not need our air conditioner to run at all. I did a little yard work in the evening and got warm, so when I came into the house to cool off, I sat under a ceiling fan in my office and let it run on high. I was cooled off to a comfy level within several minutes.

    Of course, yesterday had low dew points/relative humidity, and the slab floor of the house is still cool from prior cold spells. I do not expect to see the aforegoing results on every ninety degree day, as deeper into the warm months, ground temperatures will rise, along with the slab temperature. Humidity levels will also rise, adding to the latent load in the house. However, I do expect our cooling demand overall to be lower. The only empirical data I can hope to offer is how my house performs with the barrier added.

    BTW, it was Efficient Attic Systems that installed our barrier and increased the fiberglas insulation level in our attic. They were very pleasant to do business with. I would NOT want to do that job myself, so forking out the dough to have them do it was worth it, IMO. Although we expect some measure of payback via utility savings, the comfort payback is what I'm really after, since I like my environs pretty cool in summer (cooler than my wife likes, unfortunately).

    One added aspect regarding data gathering...I'd be interested to see MRT data for a room within a house that has radiant barrier on the roof decking compared to the same room MRT data with no radiant barrier. Mark has stated he believes the greatest benefit of RB is in attics shared with HVAC equipment. I agree with that, but would be curious as to actual MRT differences between a the room of a house with RB vs. one without it, regardless of where the HVAC equipment is located.

  8. #21
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    724

    Hmm Controlled Experiment?

    Question; how are you going to gather any meaningful data when you changed two variables? “it was Efficient Attic Systems that installed our barrier and increased the fiberglas insulation level in our attic. “
    The quality of my performance, sometimes depends on the quality of my audience.
    Imitation (Plagiarism) is the best compliment one can get -- "Open A Window"

    To improve Indoor Air Quality: Control Indoor Air QUANTITY = "I.A.Q.Q."

  9. #22
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Tennessee
    Posts
    91
    Quote Originally Posted by speedymonk View Post
    I've been toying with the idea of installing radiant barrier material on my rafters. Does this actually help reduce heat in the home (by its reflective qualities) or would simply adding more insulation be the better route? Combination? I'm guessing this helps the home envelope and would decrease both heating and cooling bills. I figured you fine professional type folk would know, Twilli in particular.
    I have a 5,000 sq/ft 1 1/2 story house with one of the units in the attic. My house has power attic fans and I'm having those removed and installing a ridge vent system. I'm also planning to install radiant barrier on the rafters. I only have access to about half of my attic rafters due to the upper story but I believe I'll still get results from the changes I plan. From what I have read it's not just one product that is the "silver bullet" cure all but it's a combination of things working together. The unit in my attic is a 3 ton and I hope I don't hear it run as much this summer. I'm sure taking out the PAV will be the biggest difference.

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