Harmony 3 compared to Infinity Control for Zoning

[novakht]

We have installed MANY Infinity zone systems, and I cant comment on the Harmony-- but as far as the Infinity-- my installers love them. They are very easy to set up and they just dont have issues with them.

I like them for that reason,but also the Infinity system is really user friendly for the homeowner.Once we go over it with them we hardly ever have call backs related to programming or use.

Some controls are a nightmare for the homeowner to learn and to get used to.The Infinity control is real simple to operate.

[Wizzard of Oz]

ZONE WARS !

He he... I have experience with Harmony, but not Infinity. The Harmony must be set up by an experienced tech, but is a great system once thats done correctly. I have heard nothing but good things about the Infinity as well, so they are both good systems when installed properly. I know your wanting to understand the difference between the zone controls, but I wouldn't make a purchase decision based solely on that alone.

[davo]

The Carrier Infinity pretty much sets its self up. Duct assessment, zone percentages and all. They are modulating dampers, that improve overall comfort and maintain temperatures like no other system. Not only do they modulate, they know the demand and trends of the other zones, and the indoor humidity level, outdoor temperature, and liquid refrigerant temperatures so the air is proportioned to throughout the home to try and allow all zones comfort settings to be satisfied at the same point in time, and then maintain that comfort setting.
I use the term "Comfort Setting" because humidity levels and setpoints are figured in operation as well. The evaporator fan motor modulates as well, as the fan curve is programed into the variable speed motor. The airflow and dampers are checked every day automatically, and if a damper fails, it will notify you. If your filter gets dirty, it will notify you. If the system fails, the onboard diagnostics are a real time saver.
We have many Infinity systems installed with the System Access Module
that call and e-mail the homeowner and us if something goes wrong, and the homeowner can change settings while away.
Customers cannot believe the constant temperatures and comfort levels.
As with any zone system, the duct work must be correct.

On the Lennox Harmoney, the wiring is far more complex, and the installers have to set up dip switches for zone percentages and type of a/c and heat.
This requires installers to make field mathmatical calculations. The formulas and directions are in the installation guide.
The air handler wiring has to be field modified and set up for a/c or heat pump. The dampers only open and close, and the fan motor tries to modulate down according to the calling zone percentage and information from a leaving air sensor. The system performs no self diagnostics or daily tests.
Our customers are very happy with the performance of the Harmoney Zoning.

The Infinity is a true communicating system, where all information is shared and utilized to create one true system and provide maximum comfort.

When the Lennox fails, the tech is on his own as there is no onboard diagnostics.


The Lennox Harmoney is nice, and will work well, and be reliable when set up properly, but it can not hold a candle to the Infinity.

Of course, with any system, installation is the key.

We have fixed maney Infinity installations installed by others, who have never performed zoning installations, and because of the apparent "ease" of Infinity installation, they jumped in with both feet and try. Replacement type work compounds this, as you are dealing with duct work that may not have been properly designed for zoning.
Hope this helps.

[bmathews]

I have put in both systems and would recommend Infinity over Harmony, hands down. Harmony is a pain in the a55 to setup. If somebody didn't want it, I would never install it. You really need a bypass of some sort on it. As we all know, with a bypass, a unit really turns into a moldy poop box faster. Infinity pretty much sets itself up. You need no bypass, because the motor ramps down when a zone closes. If you have screwed up ductwork, an Infinity is less forgiving than a Harmony. I will say that. If you go with Harmony, make sure your installer is WELL versed in it. Whereas, an Infinity will pretty much work unless the ductwork is garbage. Then you get dirty filter signals all the time. If I were installing a zoning system in my house, I would go Infinity or any of Carrier's other zoning systems over a Harmony. They have 2 other ones as well, which are quite simple to setup, you just need that d8mned bypass again.

[jdavis37]

We have installed MANY Infinity zone systems, and I cant comment on the Harmony-- but as far as the Infinity-- my installers love them. They are very easy to set up and they just dont have issues with them.

I like them for that reason,but also the Infinity system is really user friendly for the homeowner.Once we go over it with them we hardly ever have call backs related to programming or use.

Some controls are a nightmare for the homeowner to learn and to get used to.The Infinity control is real simple to operate.

Thanks Nova.. comments are greatly appreciated. Seems to match closely with what the carrier installer is telling me

[jdavis37]

ZONE WARS !

He he... I have experience with Harmony, but not Infinity. The Harmony must be set up by an experienced tech, but is a great system once thats done correctly. I have heard nothing but good things about the Infinity as well, so they are both good systems when installed properly. I know your wanting to understand the difference between the zone controls, but I wouldn't make a purchase decision based solely on that alone.

Thanks Wiz... I do trust the Lennox installer. After talkig with him on phone 2 times and then having his sales engineer show up at house to work on the heat load and ventilation design, I do have high confidence in their ability to do things right. He seems to understand the concepts discussed on here quite well.

Ease of use etc between the 2 systems is in truth not a huge thing as once you get used to something it becomes the norm. It does sound as though the Hrmony is a tougher installation so that does factor in a bit though in this case I think the guy is up to the task.

He did say some things about the Infinity system that no one here is saying ( he also sells Bryant ) such as the Infinity communications are very slow as compared to the Harmony 3. I also didn't get the sense the Harmony was a wide open/ wide shut type setup so will have to get him to explain that further. Always a good knowledge check

Thx again... your comments are very helpful!

[jdavis37]

The Carrier Infinity pretty much sets its self up. Duct assessment, zone percentages and all. They are modulating dampers, that improve overall comfort and maintain temperatures like no other system. Not only do they modulate, they know the demand and trends of the other zones, and the indoor humidity level, outdoor temperature, and liquid refrigerant temperatures so the air is proportioned to throughout the home to try and allow all zones comfort settings to be satisfied at the same point in time, and then maintain that comfort setting.
I use the term "Comfort Setting" because humidity levels and setpoints are figured in operation as well. The evaporator fan motor modulates as well, as the fan curve is programed into the variable speed motor. The airflow and dampers are checked every day automatically, and if a damper fails, it will notify you. If your filter gets dirty, it will notify you. If the system fails, the onboard diagnostics are a real time saver.
We have many Infinity systems installed with the System Access Module
that call and e-mail the homeowner and us if something goes wrong, and the homeowner can change settings while away.
Customers cannot believe the constant temperatures and comfort levels.
As with any zone system, the duct work must be correct.

On the Lennox Harmoney, the wiring is far more complex, and the installers have to set up dip switches for zone percentages and type of a/c and heat.
This requires installers to make field mathmatical calculations. The formulas and directions are in the installation guide.
The air handler wiring has to be field modified and set up for a/c or heat pump. The dampers only open and close, and the fan motor tries to modulate down according to the calling zone percentage and information from a leaving air sensor. The system performs no self diagnostics or daily tests.
Our customers are very happy with the performance of the Harmoney Zoning.

The Infinity is a true communicating system, where all information is shared and utilized to create one true system and provide maximum comfort.

When the Lennox fails, the tech is on his own as there is no onboard diagnostics.


The Lennox Harmoney is nice, and will work well, and be reliable when set up properly, but it can not hold a candle to the Infinity.

Of course, with any system, installation is the key.

We have fixed maney Infinity installations installed by others, who have never performed zoning installations, and because of the apparent "ease" of Infinity installation, they jumped in with both feet and try. Replacement type work compounds this, as you are dealing with duct work that may not have been properly designed for zoning.
Hope this helps.

Davo,

Thanks and yes your message is very helpful. Make sme plan on asking each installer how many zoned systems they have installed nad perhaps getting a reference, even though I know that is a bit hokey. Still, if they can't provide one that tell s a bigger story in itself.

Does sound as though the Lennox zoning is more complicated though, which makes me wonder aobut service down the road. Especially after the zoning system is no longer made. Thx again ))))))) Very helpful note

[jdavis37]

I have put in both systems and would recommend Infinity over Harmony, hands down. Harmony is a pain in the a55 to setup. If somebody didn't want it, I would never install it. You really need a bypass of some sort on it. As we all know, with a bypass, a unit really turns into a moldy poop box faster. Infinity pretty much sets itself up. You need no bypass, because the motor ramps down when a zone closes. If you have screwed up ductwork, an Infinity is less forgiving than a Harmony. I will say that. If you go with Harmony, make sure your installer is WELL versed in it. Whereas, an Infinity will pretty much work unless the ductwork is garbage. Then you get dirty filter signals all the time. If I were installing a zoning system in my house, I would go Infinity or any of Carrier's other zoning systems over a Harmony. They have 2 other ones as well, which are quite simple to setup, you just need that d8mned bypass again.

bmathews.. thanks for your comments. Again, it has given me some room to think it through. Just sounds like the Harmony system is indeed more complex ton properly set up. I'm praying my vent system WILL be properly designe dand set up as I am replacing the entire ductwork with exception of the boots, which will be resealed with mastic. Thx again,, is very apreciated!

[plain spoken]

He did say some things about the Infinity system that no one here is saying ( he also sells Bryant ) such as the Infinity communications are very slow as compared to the Harmony 3. Thx again... your comments are very helpful!

Only if you call communicating every 8/10 of a second slow. Sounds like the guy is feeding you a line of bull....may have to wonder about what else he is telling you.

[jdavis37]

Only if you call communicating every 8/10 of a second slow. Sounds like the guy is feeding you a line of bull....may have to wonder about what else he is telling you.

Won't disagree. I haven't heard much else to suggest the bull part but then I'm not exactly an expert by any stretch. For the most part most of what has been said seems to be on the up and up. I took this little slip as more a sales pitch of exaggeration than being bull but perhaps I'm being generous lol Thanks for the reply.... was one of those nagging questions I had when comparing the 2 zoning systems as it seemed many had said such great things about the Infinity zoning. I have a feeling this is more that he really knows the Lennox system and thus it's his favorite.

[tinknocker service tech]

the carrier is a realy nice system but if i hear correctly you have to use only thier parts on it. If the stat goes bad witch doent happen often you need thier stat and so on

the harmony can use any stat or stats. the dampers also can be any brand as long as they power the correct way. This is one thing i like about it is you are not limited

also if you do go with the lennox system then stay clear of the lennox signajar stat and go with the honeywell 8000 better options then the lennox stat.

either system will solve you comfort needs even tho the carrier will give you more user friendly controls but at a price.

[jdavis37]

the carrier is a realy nice system but if i hear correctly you have to use only thier parts on it. If the stat goes bad witch doent happen often you need thier stat and so on

the harmony can use any stat or stats. the dampers also can be any brand as long as they power the correct way. This is one thing i like about it is you are not limited

also if you do go with the lennox system then stay clear of the lennox signajar stat and go with the honeywell 8000 better options then the lennox stat.

either system will solve you comfort needs even tho the carrier will give you more user friendly controls but at a price.

Thx Tinknocker.

I"m still waiting for the quote from the Lennox installaer and am now also waiting for a revised and more detailed quote from the Carrier installer ( namely I want him to specify each component to be installed ). From verbal ( face to face ) discussions, the Carrier install will be done using only Carrier equipment, and I have no reason to doubt his word though I still need it in writing. I also asked the Carrier installer to make osme other changes which will have an affect on the quote price.

I'll expect the same detail from the Lennox installer once the quote arrives. They are a larger company and thus far have been a little more "professional " ( company vans, company attire, etc ). Course, that cones with a price, too . If memory serves me correctly, they were going to sue a Lennox Touchscreen set of stats but again I'll need to see it ion the quote. I'll also explore the Honeywell stat so thanks for sharing!