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  1. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by neophytes serendipity View Post
    The internet is not going away.

    It parallels the commercial side where retailers become "dealers" for equipment, cutting the equipment sales from the bid.

    Someone else will do it if yourefuse.

    Just Did a job where the county school system and the Poice department supplied the equipment.

  2. #67
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    190

    Internet here to stay

    The internet may be here to stay but contractors that don't price these jobs properly wil not be here for long. I agree with Skip YOU MUST INCLUDE YOUR NORMAL PRICING then back out your cost. If you can't get that then you need to walk away.

  3. #68
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Toledo, Ohio, United States
    Posts
    12,914
    Twilli says you guys are easy....



    Coleman
    No Heat No Cool You need Action Fast

  4. #69
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    The Twilight Zone
    Posts
    2,964
    Quote Originally Posted by RoBoTeq View Post
    Just as you will also eat any problems that occur from equipment that you have directly purchased.
    I eat very well.

    All is good.

    Take care.

  5. #70
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    9,548
    Quote Originally Posted by RoBoTeq View Post
    Just as you will also eat any problems that occur from equipment that you have directly purchased.
    Not true. He purchased it from a local contractor, I did the same thing. Parts warranty goes through the local contractor. No need to worry, my Goodman's have been bulletproof, of course it's my install making them...

    If Goodman's warranty standards were upheld, any company that has a website couldn't sell Goodman or they could claim it was sold online and warranty void. I don't see this happening....
    If everything was always done "by the book"....the book would never change.

  6. #71
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    N. E. Missouri
    Posts
    9,750
    Quote Originally Posted by neophytes serendipity View Post
    [LIST]If it is new equipment, it will turn on (shouldn't be DOA)
    And what is your answer when it is? As a contractor you've never had a DOA?
    (and if you say yes, we'll all know the difference)
    Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

  7. #72
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    MN
    Posts
    173
    I recently looked at published internet equipment pricing. Shipping costs are extra.

    When compared to our sell prices we are very close pricewise on every item they list with our ship and handling costs included in our sale price. I suspect its similar with others.

    For every propoasal we often beat the internet sales companies by at least a few dollars on price. We just provide a full package, equpment, labor, installation and warranty and the pricing is stated a bit differently.
    With both the contractor warranty and Mfg warranty its a no brainer if you want it done right and with a reasonable price.
    In addition the contractor is usually more in tune with your HVAC needs.

  8. #73
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Central Maryland
    Posts
    246
    Quote Originally Posted by neophytes serendipity View Post
    Smart contractors will not reveal any sizing info until there is a deposit.
    I would counter with, smart consumers do not pay money until they know what they're getting. Asking a customer to put down money without knowing tons, BTU's or whatever, let alone model numbers, may work for some customers, but in my neighborhood... let's see... we have three engineers in a row, a steam fitter and a couple of building contractors... good luck with that approach.

  9. #74
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Near Chicago, IL
    Posts
    3,317
    Quote Originally Posted by mrs reb77 View Post
    And what is your answer when it is? As a contractor you've never had a DOA?
    (and if you say yes, we'll all know the difference)
    No DOA's yet in my experience... experienced stuff breaking after start up, though. One employer had a DOA American Standard compressor- locked up out of the box.

    Why not treat DOA supplied equipment as a service call? If it has power, and it doesn't work, then call the company you bought it from or pay me to troubleshoot/fix it.

  10. #75
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Near Chicago, IL
    Posts
    3,317
    Quote Originally Posted by hangfirew8 View Post
    I would counter with, smart consumers do not pay money until they know what they're getting. Asking a customer to put down money without knowing tons, BTU's or whatever, let alone model numbers, may work for some customers, but in my neighborhood... let's see... we have three engineers in a row, a steam fitter and a couple of building contractors... good luck with that approach.
    And what does the btu rating have to do with "what you are getting"? I could see someone choosing a 100k/5 ton package over a 75k/4 ton package because "it's bigger", so it must be "better", especially if it doesn't cost much more....

    Model numbers, without the btu component can and needs to be discussed.

    The person quoting the job has to size it correctly. If the educated customers in your example see Contractor A measuring a house for a Manual J and asking questions about windows and insulation, and Contractor B checking out "what's there now" without measuring anything, who is doing a better job?

    Contractor A can easily state that the equipment is sized for your house, and the specific information will be provided with a deposit.

    All Contractor B can do is say you will get what's there now, but new.

    I would think that the smart customer would go with Contractor A....

  11. #76
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    352
    That is a very good point. If the techs you are dealing with aren't putting much thought in to their decisions for your home, it boils down only to a few reasons.

    1. They are commisioned techs and don't care as long as they get the money.
    2. Some techs see how much money they are working with, what improvements were approved and make decisions based on that.
    3. They don't know what they are doing.
    4. They are box changers (that 3 1/2 ton has worked good for 12 years.)
    5. They rely on their years of experience In the Field.

    If I scooped ice cream all day long for 12 years, I would more than likely be the best ice cream scooper around. If you find someone to who is willing to scoop it in their spare time, would the end product be the same?

    Furthermore, if that scoop of ice cream held your comfort in the balance, and determined your major utility bills for the next 15 years......

    You could pay a dollar to save a nickle if you want.

  12. #77
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    9,548
    Quote Originally Posted by hangfirew8 View Post
    I would counter with, smart consumers do not pay money until they know what they're getting. Asking a customer to put down money without knowing tons, BTU's or whatever, let alone model numbers, may work for some customers, but in my neighborhood... let's see... we have three engineers in a row, a steam fitter and a couple of building contractors... good luck with that approach.
    The proposal would include the model #'s, just not the size. The contractor's on your block wouldn't give out their design plans(prints) to a consumer in a proposal would they? If explained correctly, the consumer(rocket scientist,doesn't matter) should have all the info they need on a bid without being able to pass along sizing info to the low baller they have lined up to do the job. Your neighbors would understand this.
    If everything was always done "by the book"....the book would never change.

  13. #78
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    cincinnati ohio
    Posts
    2,024

    information

    This web site lets the home owner do a heat / cool load ( if he wants it ) and the companys selling the equipment matches the parts up to the ARI , so the customer knows what hes getting befor he orders . The one I did got all the rebates for the local gas & electric plus the federal . If we continue to lose a 50 % on every install alot of companys are goin to be laying off or going out of bussness & or working for less profit ! A mild summer will just put more pressure on everyone to lower their bids so we can all work for less ! Internet sales are not good for the hvac companys .
    My avatar is a picture of a Goodman Silencer .....These were commonly used in Goodman country ....Photos by hvac tech ( PaysonHVAC )

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